Is there a patch that'll allow for using the Touhou 6-8 continue system on Touhou 10-12?

[LemonIsASatoriFan]

Very silly question, especially thanks to the fact that I made an account specifically for this, but I've been really curious about this for around a month at this point. Is there by any chance a patch out there that'd allow me to use the Touhou 6-8 continue system for the first modern era games? After spending over 4 hours (with plentiful breaks, don't worry) trying to beat stage 5 of Subterranean Animism on Normal, alongside the over 10 hours (with EVEN MORE BREAKS, don't worry) of trying to beat Utsuho without succeeding, it really kinda killed my motivation and enjoyment of the games. I still love them to bits, but the games really just don't hit the same with the 10-12 continue system to me, personally. Honestly, at this point, it's not even really about the accomplishment, I just want to be able to get to the end of the games, continues be damned. Unfortunately, I'm not skilled enough for a 1cc, try as I might, so this is really my only option.

I've searched a very large amount of websites / forums trying to find anything about a potential continue patch, to no avail. The only time I've spotted anything related to one was on this site, in the replies on a topic related to reviewing every Touhou game (it was about SA, funnily enough), but there was no further info provided other than "yeah I used this cool continue patch".

As I said, I get this is a very stupid question lol, but quite honestly I really just wanna get back into playing the games, and I have a very hard time finding the motivation to do so as of now, so this'd be a big help. Thank you!!!

[Gri]

Yes there is.

You used thcrap for getting the english patch? If yes, simply launch thcrap and when asked to select a language patch, look at the bottom-left for a "advanced" checkbox. Check it, then the full list of patch will be displayed. Search for "continue", then the continue patch for 10-12 will appear. This patch gives you infinite continues, but the moment you use one, you get the bad ending (like Touhou 6-8).

If you haven't used thcrap, go download it from their website.

Honestly, this is by far one of the worst choice Zun's ever made. It debatably makes the first playthrough more rewarding, since it takes more time to see a new stage, but it just makes all next playthroughs very annoying, since you may not want to grid a stage on repeat to practice (there's practice mode for that). Thank god he reconsidered from Touhou 13 and onward.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Gri

[LemonIsASatoriFan]

Thank you so much!!!!!!
 

Quote

Honestly, this is by far one of the worst choice Zun's ever made.

Completely agree, even if I do somewhat understand why it was done. Super glad he changed it back in 13+.

[TheRealAEgir]

Hey !

I have a slightly different opinion on the subject. I actually started touhou by doing SA and i absolutely loved it. But then, i struggled playing the other touhou games mainly because of their continue system which i really dont like.

I did PCB and EOSD a few years ago, but i was nothing like the experience i had playing SA. A few days ago i started UFO, and i really like it. It seems that most players prefer the other continue system, but that's not the case for me.

You mentioned a patch for touhou 10-12 that change it, but is there by any chance an other patch that could do the opposite ? That could really help me liking more the other touhou game...

Thanks !

[Gri]

Nope. As far as I am aware, no patch to do the reverse. The mods just skip the line that tells the game to reset the stage, so it was "easy" to implement. The reverse would be hard, since the code that reset the stage isn't really in the game (you have to recycle part of the Practice Mode and hope it somehow still works in the main game).

Haven't try that option on touhou 13>, but there should be an option in the menu to start over the current stage.

I am curious, what do you not like about that continue system?

The only strength of the one from 10-12 I can see is that it makes clearing a stage for the first time more rewarding. On other playthrough, it's just an annoying waste of time. It forces you to grind a stage, when you might just want to move on to the next one (Not each play session has to turn into intensive training). Arcade game are nice because they are short (~30m-40m) and can fit in a busy schedules. That system just prolong the game too long when you're leaning the game, and may force you to quit (due to rage or lack of time). Not a pleasant feeling.

In the "more popular" continue system, you get to choose whether to continue your run as a practice run where you practice each stage equally, or whether to stop and grind a specific stage over and over in the practice mode (or even grind a spell in Spell Practice).

Of course, in both case, the moment you use a continue, you lost. So in my case, when I lose, I prefer the system that let's me choose how I want to practice, over the one that force me to grind RIGHT NOW. I'll manage my own training thanks.

Note: Touhou8 has the worst system. You can use continues, but not in Stage6B, where you are very likely to use one.

Edited March 22 by Gri

[TheRealAEgir]

Hi,

Thank you for the quick answer ! I'll respond to your interrogation, and i think i need to explain my experience with touhou in order to do that.

First, i think i need to say that, although i'm not a "hardcore" gamer, i still enjoy most of my game when they are hard. Examples from my favorite games include celeste, hollow knight and geometry dash (in which i spent several hundreds of hours, but i was a long time ago when i was still at school and had much more free time...). It was actually this point that brought me into touhou (plus the fact that i just started getting interested in japanese culture and anime), and it's also the fact why i started with SA. I learned about touhou, jumped in a discord server in which i asked for the best touhou game irrespective of difficulty.

You are right about the continue system, i liked it because it felt really satisfying clearing a stage for the first time. When i started SA, i wasn't able to clear stage 2. The first time i did, i went to stage 3 and it really felt like i would never be able to finish it, had to put several hours before doing so. This feeling was intensified for every stage, at a point where each new spell card felt like a big accomplishement before dying immediatly, being frustrated and thinking again that i will never be able to finish it. I spent about 30 hours to complete the normal 1cc run, but when i did, i really felt satisfying (probably not my hardest gaming achievement, but probably the one that felt the most satisfying).

Then, i moved to PCB. I launched the game, started the first run and 30-40 minutes after, finished the game (with continues). And that was it. No more new stage, no more new spell, no more challenge. Of course, PCB is way easier than SA, and i already acquiered some experience doing the SA 1cc run, and it was going to be easier. But it really felt empty. I then started training a bit, and cleared the first normal 1cc run after 4-5 hours, about the same time that i spent clearing the stage 3 for the first time in SA. Dont get me wrong, PCB is really a great touhou game and the final stage is awesome, but the experience i had with it was way less intense than SA.

After that, i tried playing a bit of IN ans WBAWC, but i couldn't get into them and i droped touhou for a couple of years. I got interested again after meeting someone who played touhou IRL, and that's when i played EOSD. I guess it was alright, but again felt really easy. Again, droped touhou for a couple of years, and i just started UFO, were i am now. As i said earlier, i kinda experience UFO the same way i did with SA. Maybe it's the fact that i didn't played touhou for quite some time, but it seems challenging (right now, i spent about 8-9 hours and got to stage 6 twice, i'll probably clear it within 10-15 hours playtime).

So yeah, that's my experience with touhou, and why i love the touhou 10-12 continue system. I now that you are gonna tell me to try hard mode or maybe lunatic, or even try extra stage (which i somehow never did). Maybe i will, maybe not, i unfortunately don't have much free time now... Right now, i think i'm gonna 1cc UFO and try MOF. If it feal too easy, maybe i'll drop it and try again in a couple of years?...

Anyway, thank again for the response! At least i tried x)

[Gri]

Have you tried LOLK?

That one is the only one with the PointDevice mode. A mode where you must do a no-miss clear, but when you get hit, you restart at a checkpoint. Bombs are allowed, but limited so be careful to not use them or you'll be "softlock" at stage 5 or 6. It is also the only game that can save your progression. This feels more in line with what you are searching. 

Also, the option should be there for touhou 13> to retry from the beginning of the stage. You can use it.

Touhou are arcade games, so you are expected to replay them over and over until you've "master them", which the original continue system encourage. The "satisfaction" comes from finally getting the good ending with 1CC.

I would mind the other system less if you could still win after retrying a stage, as well as save your progression. It would mean the struggles on a specific stage would be rewarded eventually. As is it now, you might as well give up, start over from the beginning to get more resources and get a better chance at passing the later stages. The worse thing, is that it encourage you to play "in a bad way". Say you are on your last live, on the last spell of the stage 5 boss and still have some bombs, then you'll be very tempted to waste all your bombs and reach the "stage 6 checkpoint" (since you become tired after awhile of playing the same stage), rather than actually trying your best.

Personally, I kinda wish Zun would have implemented PointDevice for every game after LOLK. The "issue" in LOLK was that the game was design with PointDevice in mind, so it is much harder than any other Touhou (and they are BS spell that kills you if you aren't in the correct spot before the attack starts. Not punishing with unlimited lives, very bad on Legacy mode).

Edited March 25 by Gri

[TheRealAEgir]

LOLK had quite a bad reputation in the touhou discord i joined, so i didn't actually imagined playing it one day. They said it was too difficult in an "unfair" way. I didn't knew about that PointDevice mode.

I guess i'll try it then !