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CountVonNumenor

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Everything posted by CountVonNumenor

  1. Oh, it's been a while since I have last been here. Honestly, I forgot I wrote the thread, and I was very close to "starting" it this afternoon. However, good to see it is already here. I think we did. We just need a reminder on the conclusion from that discussion. In that case, probably one of the most interesting ZUN comments about age is related to one of his "Miscellaneous drawings" from before EoSD. He said he wanted to draw an adult in one of these images, but said it ended up much younger than he planned. I don't think I have noticed the lipstick before. What image/art of hers is that?
  2. For quite some time now, it may seem like I have been missing from the Shrine. Yeah, I really did. Recently, I've really felt devoid of ideas to write about at the Shrine. Ran out of any inspiration or interesting topics. And the decrease in interaction with what I already created has also been a little deterring. But the final nail in the coffin has been the beginning of the exams. I really hope those will be over soon... As for something different, I actually started watching Amagami. Until now, I only had time for one arc, but I would like to get one more this weekend. First story arc has been that of Morishima Haruka. I will not go into spoiler territory with what is going on (I may have already spoiled it from her character introduction), but I think it was a nice story. Sure, like in any anime, especially those that have romantic plots, you may still have one of those eye-rolling moments, and one of the points I've seen in another video recently seems to apply (even if just like 1-2 times as of yet) about the use of female fanservice applies. But as a whole, I think the first arc has been quite a nice way to spend one evening (since it's just 4 episodes, about 24-25 minutes long). Heck, and I even ended up liking Haruka more than I expected. As for side characters, I like the way they were handles. Each of the girls still exists, even if they are downgraded to episodic appearances. Probably the characters that get most of the screentime, besides Junichi and Haruka, might be Miya (Junichi's younger sister), Umehara and Kaoru, the latter two being Junichi's comrades he might get into a friendly banter with (especially with Kaoru, it's almost like a gag through the arc). Anyway, time for next arc. This time, the story will focus on Kaoru. Given the way this series works, and the nature of the source material, I really wonder how it will handle the fact you basically make a story arc out of each game route. Does the timeline simply repeat? Does the poor Junichi live Groundhog Day each time the arc ends? It remains to be seen... PS: to my understanding about this series. Amagami SS is basically treated as a Season 1 of the series, which came out in 2010 (25 episodes). Amagami SS+ Plus is basically Season 2, and that one came out in 2012 (13 episodes). Besides the two "seasons", there are also two OVAs for Amagami SS, and the Specials for SS+ Plus. And then there is one more anime called Seiren, released in 2017 and basically considered a sequel to Amagami (I know that apparently Seiren takes place in the same universe).
  3. Honestly, I would say that we could post the next round. If we are to take it like this, it might take weeks until we are getting more replies. Especially given how inactive has the forum been as a whole recently.
  4. @Sci or anyone from the moderation team, sorry for the ping. But can someone fix a little bit the Telegram crypto scam that just randomly popped up in the thread last night? I have no idea what happened, but now it is here. I really did not wish for this thread to be brought back into discussion that way...
  5. I have considered watching Cowboy Bebop for more than 2 years. However, I do not have a Netflix account (for using the most legal way of watching it), so I'd have to borrow my sister's account (I don't have my own account due to the fact I am barely watching films and series anymore, and am too lazy to go online search for those things if I really have to actually watch them; most of watch time for things has moved to YouTube). But I have heard that series is really good, so thank you for the suggestion.
  6. I think from now on, this thread can basically be known as "Part I" of the entire discussion. Maybe it will become a trilogy?
  7. Honestly, this is the first time when I hear anyone comparing anime to soap opera, and therefore I m feeling a little surprised of the comparison. Especially when, at least here in Romania, we understand "soap opera" through the word "telenovela". But if you mean the idea of mass-production and repetitive plots/plot elements, then I may be able to see the similarity. I really have not though that the Japanese themselves would actually have problems with anime. Especially how popular and seemingly everywhere it is while walking on the streets of their big cities. As for quality stuff, I am still looking for something to start from. Yet I am not sure what anime series to start up with. I have watched all 17 episodes of Memories of Phantasm, the TeamFourStar Abridged version of Hellsing Ultimate, and was planning to watch the anime adaptation of Amagami. I will come back to this one a bit later in the reply, when I will attach some media recommendations for the continuing of the discussion. And again, this is why I am looking for some recommendation, or better said a starting point if I want to explore the medium. The entire idea of this thread started last year, based on a thread that was over 2 years ago. I have been writing on this topic since I am unfamiliar with anime, had never watched an anime or read a manga before, and just could not understand the sheer hate the entire medium of Japanese production has been receiving online on different forums. And from there, the original ("Part I") version of the thread. There are a few things I may have understood from here, and I have the feeling that all of them might be wrong. Could you please elaborate some more in here? Especially in the part related to ZUN. Interesting take, especially hearing from someone who draws (I have seen your drawings in the past, they are very good). Most of the time, I have not thought about the anime art style being lacking in originality, but at a closer inspection, there may actually be reasons for the claim. But to be honest, I completely lack artistic culture, and have quite a hard time processing a drawing more than just "I like this" or "neuron activation". I just like something, and do not actually understand why I like it. Besides, I already explained in a previous thread how I even ended up in the anime area, s well as orienting my drawing style towards anime despite lacking any sort of basis even in basic drawing. Again, I would really like to hear a lot more about the topic of the art style in itself, as well as more on the ideas you have expressed. Well, there was originally this thread: I have used Safebooru in the past, for about half a year. However, I got really bored of it, and after getting more used to the nature of content on Danbooru, I ended up preferring to use that board instead of the safe board. I am very sure Danbooru has way more content than Safebooru, even within the safe for work images. I guess it is a small price to pay for getting to all the delicious content.... Alright, in regards to the annex content I was talking about. @_.Mevs I think you will be finding these interesting, especially if connecting with your recent thread. There are 3 videos I find very relevant for the discussion, and I would like to share them. I am warning you from the start though, the longest one of them is over an hour long. The two are 40, respectively 16 minutes long. 1) This one starts on a bit of a joke note - how would an anime girl look like if you were to build one in real life. Th results are... kind of expected. However, in the second half, it suddenly turns into a psychological discussion about why we like waifus and what happens inside our brain. At least if I remember well (it's been over a year since I last watched the video): 2) The 1 hour and 15 minutes long video on the whole concept of "waifu" and "waifu-ism". A very interesting overview of the history of the concept, how it evolved in anime, as well as some of the pitfalls some series might be falling into when they design a series around a moe character instead of the characters as part of a series: 3) From the same author, again an analysis video, but on the concept of fanservice. A brief history of how it appeared and evolved in anime, accompanied by some examples of good and bad use of fanservice. And just like before, a discussion on why people may have a problem with the whole concept. I have found the entire section discussing about the reception of fanservice very interesting, as well as that in which the author mentioned the Hayes Code (which I never knew before), that may have put the United States 30 years in the past with the evolution of animation and themes approached (I have doubts though that the rest of the world outside Japan has a more liberal view on nudity and sexuality, or at least not as open as that of the "Sunrise Land"). The video about fanservice is actually very relevant, given that I have talked quite a lot about Touhou Memories of Phantasm around Christmas, as well as the use of this tool in that anime. Bonus, a lot of very quotable sentences: "I am of the firm belief that you should just mentally increase the age of any anime character by like three years because it'll make the show better. Ain't no way that Okabe this scruffy looking college dude is meant to be 18. This man is clearly like 25." (in reference to a scene presented on screen) "But hey sometimes these are just children you're showing me. That is a fucking child. I don't care if age is just a number. That number is 9-1-1 you should be in fucking prison [Ladies and gentlemen, we got him starts playing]" (in regards to another fanservice scene of more questionable nature, featuring the classic "9000 year old loli" trope) The comment section also offered some very good replies for this latter video: "The thing that really turns me off of fanservice is the recurring theme of “against their will”. SOOOO much fanservice in anime is women being exposed, groped, viewed, or straight up assaulted against their will, and it’s always played for lighthearted fun. Even shows where fanservice fun is the entire point focus mainly on girls being unwillingly sexualized, with male consequences (if any) portrayed as a simple punchline. Female characters who are proactively sexual seem to be rare (not nonexistent, but heavily outnumbered by sexy girls who don’t want to be sexualized)" "I never watched fire force, but based on what was shown here I don't think any subversion of trope could've saved that Tamaki character. Her entire thing apparently is existing to be harassed "by accident" over and over again. So even in the scenes where this somehow makes her win a fight and makes her opponent look ridiculous, she's still being harassed and humiliated and dehumanized. She's the most exaggerated example of why I've been so turned off by anime for a while and still am very cautious with what I watch. They have to include a woman being harassed for laughs at least once in so many shows and it gets fucking old really quick" (the video used Fire Force as an example of fanservice executed poorly and in improper moments) "I think it also bears mentioning that a lot of the arguments against fan service aren’t against sexuality in media, but rather specifically, the objectification of women, and portraying sexual harassment as something that is funny or light hearted. I see a lot of people not realizing that watching someone being objectified, can make the viewer feel objectified." "From what I've seen, sex and nudity in anime is never seen as intimate or a sign of trust. Sex is depicted and silly, lewd, and depraved. It's treated both as a punchline and as a gesture. Personally, I think sex and nudity in anime should be like the James bond films where they only happen if there is an actual scene of intimacy/intercourse, which never happens in anime." "I think when you were contrasting Kill la Kill to Fire Force you hit the nail on the head for me for what makes me totally chill about fanservice vs not liking it. As a woman who's watched hundreds of series, I went through a phase where I didn't mind fanservice at all because I was so desencitized to it, to it being incredibly annoying, to now trying to look at it in a more balanced way. The two things that break fanservice for me is consent and tone. Fan service for comedy or in romance shows is perfect. Not when it interrupts really impactful moments. But consent is the biggest element to me now. Consent is why I loved Dress Up Darling and why characters like Yoruichi from Bleach are amazing. Consent is why I thought Food Wars was genius when I first saw it. And consent is why I don't want to put up with ecchi shows that cheaply disrespect their characters." (oh yeah, Food Wars and Kill la Kill were used as an example of well executed fanservice) "I've seen people use the term "perv pandering" to specifically refer to the sexual type of fanservice. I always preferred that term. It feels more accurate because as a fan, often those sorts of scenes feel like a disservice to me." "Honestly I think the biggest issue you run into with fanservice is how insidious and unexpected it can be. You've got some shows that are right out there with the fact that this is what you're getting, but then there are others marketing themselves as Serious Anime, or even Art Pieces, and you get two episodes in and it's actually another box of Whoops, All Titties. This leads a lot of people in that "I like fanservice when it's in its place/unintrusive" to just...not be able to trust anime at large. The other bit is when it's lazy. There are a lot of showrunners who clearly don't think much of their audience, because they're sure we'll be content with "plot" instead of plot, when unfortunately for them the truth is most of us are well aware of great shows that have both. The idea that a non-porn show doesn't have to be engaging if it's sexy enough is just...incorrect. But it seems like writers fall for this idea all the time." "As a "not cis male" anime watcher my biggest problem with it is when it's very obviously non-consensual (like Tamaki). ESPECIALLY when the characters are clearly minors (middle and high schoolers often get this treatment) And seeing characters of my own demographic getting hyper-sexualised in these ways is extremely dehumanizing and feels very rape-y. One example is the bathroom scene in Konosuba S1, I've genuinely never felt so uncomfortable watching an anime scene, and I've seen some messed up shit. Having a very real problem get used for laughs is degrading. But I've given up on shows like Fire Force solely because of the fanservice. I don't expect many male anime watchers to fully understand just how awfully this content can affect us, but I'd love to hear it be acknowledged as this kind of media trivializes things like assault and objectification." "The most off-putting part of fanservice for me is when it’s inappropriately done to extremely underage looking female characters… and the quickest example I can give is No Game No Life" "I remember watching Kill La Kill and Ryuko being extremely embarrassed when she transformed. Throughout the show she learns to accept Senketsu and embrace her power growing as character. I don't know, seeing a lot of crazy fanservice in anime that just felt forced, it was pretty interesting to see the whole trope flipped on its head. Sits as one of my favourite shows because of it." "I usually dislike fanservice because it often ruins the tone or otherwise breaks immersion. That said Kill La Kill is my favorite anime of all time. It brilliantly subverts and incorporates the trope while managing to keep an interesting story and endearing characters. It's flashy, over the top, and surprisingly earnest. It has a distinct style that's shamelessly fun, and the goofy fanservice fits in seamlessly with all the epic shots and hectic animation." "Part of the reason why I'm put off by fanservice is that more and more anime rely on it. It's not just the occasional moment to de-escalate tensions, that in itself tends to be fine. It happens so often both within singular titles and within the anime roster as a whole to the point that it feels overdone. There are times where it makes sense, such as Ranma 1/2 and Panty and Stocking with Garterbelt where they serve as part of the premise. The former uses it occasionally and has other jokes and action happening to desaturate the fanservice; the latter tells you in the title that the fanservice is the premise but is surprisingly good with action scenes that HAPPEN to have mature jokes rather than relying solely on said jokes. What I didn't like about Interspecies Reviewers was that the fanservice was everything: the joke, the plot (even the overarching one towards the end), the motivation of the characters. While funny at times, it ruined my sense of immersion because I couldn't stop thinking about how a society could function with so many 'adult workers' (the series itself establishes that cross-breeding with succubi over generations has basically resulted in the industry). As a result, the world in which these characters reside lacks depth and the main cast lack any actual defining character traits. And that's what I feel is happening with a lot of titles: they push fanservice to the point of absurdity that cheapens the overall experience." "Personally I get really put off (almost grossed) by almost all fan service, even stuff like Food Wars’. But I can still recognize what good and bad implementation of nudity is and definitely agree on every part there. But my main gripe isn’t shows with fan service, good or bad, even if it ruins the story because I can avoid those. It’s how fan service makes talking about anime with people who don’t watch it a lot more awkward. What I love are good stories, comedic or dramatic moments, beautiful scenery and memorable characters, no matter the medium. Anime has a lot of that which is why I watch a lot of anime, not because of the lewd content but it’s weird justifying it in conversations with people who have never seen an anime before." "The last time fanservice seriously put me off was Fire Force. I’m no prude but something about the “against her will” element really turned me off to the point of finding it unbearable. The scenes with Tamaki border on sexual harassment as she is undressed and groped; She cries and feels humiliated. It’s not like it’s fun for her… I’m not usually too bothered by fanservice but I can say this one actually kind of disturbed me" "The first anime i watched fully was Highschool DXD. I was shocked about how much fanservice was in there. Then I went on to look at other things, but looking back at it I would say that it was a good start because it didn't get in the way of the story and fit due to Issei being a literal pervert but he isn't just a pervert" "It's nice to see a detailed take on fanservice and proper examples not only for and against it, but just showing how rooted it is in the medium. However, i feel like my own personal tastes are still way too against it - even with this knowledge - to really tolerate it again. I wish it weren't so, but it's just not something I'm interested in seeing. One would say maybe I'm just not an anime kinda guy, and that may be true ... but I guess the better thing to do would be to keep looking. I'm sure there's a ton of good anime out there still that doesn't really try to do anything with it ... so long as I keep digging" "To me, I always groan whenever the kind of fanservice pop up that is just in the way of the plot and trying to do things for cheap laughs. I kinda liken it to the jump-scare in horror games. Its cheap and easy and just get's a simple instinctual reaction out of the viewer. Nothing that was made with actual thought that sticks with you. The one fanservice scene I can say was well done was the second dance scene between Ledo and Amy in Suisei No Gargantaia. That one was a wonderful moment of character building and was just sweet overall. The whole thing being set to the background of auroras and a gentle flute melody really sold it" "I feel like you can have nudity or forced feeling fanservice in an anime but it needs to feel natural. Like in Ghost in The Shell the beginning of the movie you literally see her entire naked body but it'a done in a way that's supposed to be tasteful. Fanservice is totally fine in anime and if people like the anime they like because of it then more power to them, but when it's overdone and so forced it sometimes just makes me roll my eyes and it's one of the reasons I'm really not into most anime" "Maybe this is just me, but I usually dislike fan service in animes because a lot of times it’s women in embarrassing/ humiliating situations - it’s never done to make them feel cool or be in power (I’ve only seen it to be the case in rare situations). I would feel so much comfortable if they were fine with it and enjoying themselves. Many times they’re shown as innocent beings who’re not realising they’re turning the guys on by accidentally flashing them their underwears etc. Honestly, I just want the women who’re doing fan service to do it because they want to and feel like it, and I want their characters to have their own arch’s and be well developed and not there just for fan service. Erza from fairy tail was my favourite character because of this while I hated Lucy." "The tonal dissonance comes from the fact that the creators don't expect horniness to distract from the heroic fantasy of the story; they expect that it's supposed to enhance it, which is mostly only possible if you see the character more as a sex object and a trophy to be won, rather than a person who has just suffered trauma and is emotionally distraught. The problem is that you have more empathy for her than the creators expected, but that's not your mistake." (again, in reference to Fire Force) "Y'know, when you started talking about shows that weaved fanservice into the narrative, I thought back to a show for which I did fansub translations -- it was called Yumeria. And yeah, it definitely wove fanservice into the narrative; the core premise is that these overly endowed girls and a few lolis gain super powers to fight monsters by being groped by the MC. Yeah... seriously. The thing is that the narrative is overall weak and the show tries to mix in too much and it gets overall confused... like they try to fit in a conventional teen romance storyline, and then a love... parallelogram. And in the middle, the lolis sink back from being lolis to just being ordinary kids who want to be kids. And in all of it, somehow, sexual assault as a form of recharging warriors' batteries still has to drive a sci-fi narrative. The end result is that an attempt to use fanservice intelligently only gets lost and no longer appears intelligent at all. One example that I love is Mushoku Tensei. There are loads of sex jokes, typical fanservice tropes, lewd inner thoughts, all of the things that people hate, but the MC actually matures throughout the series and so, too, does the application of the fanservice. It becomes less and less out of hand and less and less out of place progressively throughout the show." "I don't mind mild fan service when it fits the mood/situation. When it takes you out of the moment for some cheap sex sale, it's really hard for me to continue watching. Like you said, it destroys the tension they were just building. There are a lot, a LOT, of series that don't do this and it's great but I wish that the "time and place for everything" was taken to heart a little more. To clarify further. I don't think there should be NO fan servive. Just because I'm not a fan of it doesn't mean other people can't have it." "Man this video gave me so much to think about regarding anime fan service. Like you just glossed over it but that fact that magical girl anime often seem to cross the line into some form of nudity frustrates me and it starts to make sense considering the lines you can trace from them back to cutie honey. You also had a pretty strong stance about how fan service can be used well or poorly, which was provoking. But it still felt like a bit of a generalization. Like there’s probably been thousands of attempts in writing and video to address why some people (ie in America) are more comfortable seeing extreme violence and gore than skin or nudity. But it still felt like a bit of an oversimplification to say the whole community is being immature by not liking nudity in anime." "The thing people fail to understand is that anime and manga are not 'art', and few of them try very much to BE 'art'. It's popular entertainment for a Japanese audience. I'm not saying that the mangaka/anime writers never have a thought in their head while creating their work, but the whole thing is very business-driven. Anime and Manga is like if Pulp Fiction never died off, or like if Western Comics never 'grew up'. A lot of manga magazines have reader votes or reader surveys, which can heavily influence the content of the manga in the magazine. If a series does not thrill an audience in any way, it gets axed. And what's an easy way to thrill an audience when you've got nothing else up your sleeve? Fanservice! When there's a slump in sales or votes, the mangaka and the editor/s they work with tend to do some hasty course correction to bring back the hype. Some mangaka do some hard thinking and rework the story. Others just say "hmm, I guess it just needs more fanservice next time..." "I’m not against romantic or sexy scenes/situations in anime. If you’ve ever seen/read Tokyo Ghoul, I think the way they handled that scene with Kaneki and Touka was beautiful. Especially in the manga. Everything was consensual, amazingly, with Touka even initiating it. Kaneki didn’t force, grope or pressure her for anything. He treated her like a person, like he cared, and was considerate of her the whole time. I thought he was very sweet, more than what you’d even get in shoujo/josei anime/manga most of the time, and this was a seinen. The audience still got their skin shots, but Touka was never reduced to body parts and strange sounds. It’s the absurd, perverse and even cruel ways fanservice is done that’s the problem. And that the female characters entire purpose is for sexual stimulation. I don’t see how it could possibly hurt to show the male characters treating the female characters with more care, decency and empathy. And for the female characters to offer MORE than just sexual arousal. Surely this would only be a benefit." "100% agree about Tamaki. almost quit the show over her first "pervert" scene. i know other people get semi nude but they never "accidently" have hands laid on their genitals as a joke." (again, in reference to the Fire Force segment) "My biggest issue with sexual fanservice in anime are more the ones where the "women" are incredibly infantilized (or straight up are young girls)... which, unfortunately is most of them." "The sort of sexual, exploitative fanservice is really what has kept me out of getting into anime as a whole, and it’s really unfortunate. There’s so much wonderful, quality content, but there have also been so many occasions when I start a show and I’m disappointed by unnecessary tiddie shots and objectification of female characters. Watching it as a woman completely takes me out of it and it’s so frustrating. I just want to watch something interesting without having to worry about being reminded of how the world views women as pieces of meat." "This video really changed my perspective in fanservice. I'm the type of person who avoids an anime the moment I notice a big titty character or skimpy clothing 'cause there's only one way that goes to, sexualization. Kill la Kill was one of those animes. I never planned on watching it, but after your explanation on how the fanservice in the show is used, it genuinely sounds like an anime I would enjoy. I guess I got unlucky on my first introduction to it. The posts I've seen on it were people being those background characters of men having nosebleeds, jaws on the floor. Some fan's (most likely male) posts completely ignore the whole point of "empowering sexuality" and talk about how "submissive an breedable they soooo look" instead. The whole rape joke and fetish all over again. Even when the anime was talking about how empowering sexuality can be, they still somehow only see it as their porno to come back to. I do plan on watching Kill la Kill after this though. Good vid and explanation over all." "Personally I think that the “anime is trash and so am I” thing is not about fan-service and nudity, but about the bottom of the barrel filth storytelling that floods the medium, like Asterisk War, or Slave Harem in the Labyrinth of another world" "For me, the bad part of fanservice is simply the tonal dissonance, and the morally questionable, for example: Clearly underage characters experiencing it, non-consensual, and intrusive to the story. In general I don't like it, but that's what I hate the most if it happens" "Your explanation of how Fire Force perpetuates fanservice negativity is perfect! I'm all for fun ridiculous fanservice, sexual expression, and sex positivity but when it's literally ruining the character's legitimacy within that world it's being done wrong. The other thing that becomes problematic in a lot of anime is when women are portrayed as unintelligent, always needing to rely on the male protagonist, or just not being capable in almost any capacity" "Not really. This is one of those situations where discussing something from within the fandom does a disservice to the complexities. In Japan, the concept of "service" predates anime and is everywhere throughout the culture. For example, before Cutie Honey we have idols, who are packaged and presented in a very similar way as anime. Especially in the 1970s, it was common for most female stars to present "fan service" in the form of nude or gravure photography. In the 1960s the film genre called "Pink film" started, where almost every woman had nude scenes, even if they were a major actor/protagonist. Within the world of adult entertainment, prostitution, etc, it's always been common practice to refer to these things as "service". The word is wildly used this way in Japan. "Fan service", is a slang that developed somewhat alongside anime, but denotes services which are done complimentary, or for free for the fans. And in Japanese we use this word all the time to refer to risky/suggestive things. Even 30 years ago it's normal ask a girl to give you "service" as a euphemism for perverted stuff. Explaining "fan service" in this way hyper focuses this to anime industry, when this is a wider, older and much more engrained cultural phenomenon in Japan. This is not anime, this is Japanese culture." "You didn't touch on the biggest problem with fan service, which is how lead R18 scenes in anime that rarely impact the plot and fuel, while not the majority, a large group of R18 culture male anime fans, especially in the Philippines and Japan. Fan service birthed Legend of the Archfiend, Redo of Healer and the excessive amount of R18 in Berserk that didn't fuel the plot and the one that did was completely trumped by making Casca basically brain dead and a target for it to be attempted on her again." "Although it's nice to see empowerment through sexualization every once in a while, I wish that wasn't the ONLY form of empowerment that gets talked about when it comes to anime. As a woman who's male friends watch a lot of anime, I'm very picky with what I watch because the way women are generally depicted in shows. Not just the sexualization, but the lack of meaningful stories, the lack of detail on the woman experience, the lack of the woman perspective on relationships. I don't want the only shows that empower women to be through extreme fanservice that they are aware of, although those shows themselves are good. I agree with including fanservice in a good way, and a big part of that is through the equality of it and "not just the hot girls" like you said for food wars, and fanservice that also fits the tone of the story. BUT! I dislike the disregard of it being male pandering because definitely, most of time, it's only for men, or maaayyyybe wlw. As a woman, seeing jiggly boobs, even in a "good" way, throughout the entire show without anything coming from the opposite sex, is unappealing. It's fanservice for male fans, not fans in general. I'm not against nudity in shows, live action or animated. But for say, live action fantasy shows showing misogyny through overused explicit rape scenes, I still don't appreciate it. I think this video essay would have been a lot more insightful if it delved deeper into a woman's perspective on anime. Throughout the entire thing, women's perspectives and psyche are talked about as a hypothetical, a concept, a mystical idea that takes aot to understand, but not a simple, real thing that can be put off by these shows. If you ever do a part two, I'd love for you to feature a woman who is an anime enthusiast where the two of you can have a discussion on this topic. Is extreme but self aware sexualization always empowering? Even if the fanservice is good for plot, is it still fun for a woman to watch a bunch of jiggling boobs on screen? Definitely feel like this was a huge missed topic." "I have only one minor gripe with this essay, and it's in the fire force section and was when talking about how Tamaki being borderline nude while begging Shinra to save her after having her clothes burnt off took away from the tension. My issue is simply that I believe it's a disservice to say it is less impactful, I haven't personally seen Fire Force but I do dabble in narrative artistry and the decision to have her not regain any form of dignity is a conscious one to show how desperate she is in that moment, she's vulnerable and weak at that point and relying on the only one of her team mates there to help her. I believe this because my basic assumption is that between her having her clothes burnt off for the gag, which I agree is distracting since she was already on the side and there was no need to poke fun at her, and her begging Shinra there was a small fight. The joke had time to make it's exit before the focus returned to her. I could be wrong about the timescale but the way the video addressed it made it seem like there was some time between the two events though that would be exclusively for the viewer. Cinematic time as it were. I pretty much agree with everything else, it is pretty bad to see a character's potential wasted for a joke regardless of context be it the weak coward archetype who doesn't ever get stronger or the overtly sexualized token girl." "Something I notice in all the clips featuring Tamaki is that she seems pretty mortified by being exposed in these ways. But, if this really is a curse that she's been afflicted with for God knows how long, shouldn't she be used to it by now? Shouldn't her coworkers? I think it could have present some interesting opportunities to have her be numb to her curse or even just begrudgingly used to it. At the very least, I think it would have gone a long way towards allowing the fanservice to exist without being so tonally dissonant. Honestly, that kind of compulsory embarrassment which is so common in anime fanservice scenes is a good example of the immaturity you refer to near the ending. The Ur example of this is the "walk-in" trope, where a character — usually a male — walks in on another — usually female — character and reacts extremely and often violently embarrassed. What always gets me about such scenes is the compulsory aspect of it, as if it were impossible for a person to react any other way. It's so ubiquitous that, when it is subverted in any way, viewers (myself included) almost always express relief that something different finally happened. It ultimately just comes down to how thoughtless most creators' treatment of sexuality is. They really seem to struggle with integrating sexuality into their characters in non-cliché ways, and allowing that integration to be informed by their a character's personality, rather than (what I can only assume) are deep-seated cultural notions about propriety and decency — i.e. Tamaki can't be too blasé about being exposed, or else certain viewers might become judgmental or disapproving, but that's opening a bag of worms I am not well-informed enough to open. Really, it's just disheartening to think that so many creators just seem unwilling to do anything interesting or unique with this subject matter." "I'm gonna throw my hat into the ring, so lets start off and say that yes I am a straight male and yes I do enjoy fanservice okay moving on. I find anime girls to be attractive, they are usually drawn that way for a reason, and as long as there's a distinct line between when its okay and not okay for fanservice then why not their fictional characters and I don't think its harming anyone. That being said, why does nezuko's boobs get bigger in her deomon form, and yes I've heard the excuse that it makes her seem older and more mature to show that shes transformed, but like the horns already do that and like even if I agree to the previous statement they don't need to be so noticeable. And then there's Marin Kitigawa, I liked dress up darling but lady really couldn't tell that she was making gojo uncomfortable or the fact that she's stripping in front of him! Giving a female character some extra cake is effectively the same as giving a male a 6 pack, its just a hint of fanservice that doesn't disrupt the show, fanservice might even enhance it in the case of chainsaw man. But Asuna falling onto kirito so he can grope her has no reason in existing. There, that's my defense and prosecution of fanservice, same time next week." "I'm pretty disappointed that you didn't really talk about the huge issue most people have with fanservice. yes, you mentioned it in passing, but not until heavily into the video. What I'm referring to is that, most if not all fan service is just sexual assault/harassments. That most fan service is extremely triggering to SA victims, how in animes where there's non consensual sexualization, the writers have no interest in showing the deep psychological repercussions that come with SA. It always "oops haha I'm so embarrassed that you explicitly touched me, anyways i dont care anymore" whereas normal humans will be scarred by that for years even. Another thing that you only grazed over that's a huge part of the problematic with fan service is the minor element. Many MANY animes sexualize minors, most MC in shonen and popular anime are in high school. MINORS. It not just something to gaslight yourself into thinking its fine because they look older than their actual age. these characters are in school uniforms, going to class, living with parents, summer break, etc. The characters are not only "technically" minors but are portrayed in their lives, clothing, scenes, and mental dilemmas as such. Last thing I wish you had spoken about is the "male gaze" and how in american film analysis that this sexualization of strictly feminine characters is detrimental to the character itself. I do appreciate your research into Kill L Kill because you mentioned how the way they used fan service in that anime was to empower the women instead of degrade them.(not quite a subversion of the male gaze but more a satire) Long story short, if your going to do a video essay on a deep dive into fan service you should cover all bases in depth instead of passingly mentioning them. Especially since the things you passingly spoke on was very serious topics that should have given a content/trigger warning at the beginning of the video. Other than that I did enjoy your video, I just don't like important criticisms to be excluded from the conversation." "I just hate how so much fan service is with minors. It’s sexualizing children and potentially desensitizing people to predators, or thinking that it’s normal and ok to be attracted to minors. I have no issue with fan service of adult characters but that seems so rare to come across in anime. It’s mostly with teenage girls in high school. And knowing how bad sexual assault and molestation is in Japan makes watching anime with so much fan service of minors that much more uncomfortable" "The "problem" with fanservice and many people forget... Japan is the target audience of manga and anime, not the rest of the world. And they have a different view in a lot of things (lolis and shotas principally). A great example is the manga kenichi, history strongest disciple: had a great story, still had some fanservice here and there, but nothing big or anything like that... but sales were down, so what happened? At chapter 300 PUM! SUPER MEGA FANSERVICE outta nowhere... the plot which was already good (at my view point) just became secondary to making every single female naked... and not a little, but fully nude and becoming an "almost hentai" type of manga... and this let the author make a new manga about spies... which has even more fanservice and is contender for "I can't believe this is not hentai" type of manga... So yeah, Japan and sales are the ones that have the last words when it comes to what we get in this side of the world" (does anyone actually read these texts I am usually inserting into the threads and comments?) If there is anything you would like to say, I would really like to continue this discussion, or any other thread I started. I have been feeling quite alone recently, especially since there has been so little activity at the Shrine since the beginning of the year, or at least past couple weeks. And this place was one of the few where I could still communicate with other people in a civilized manner and not be berated for writing too much.
  8. Honestly, I am not sure how it works besides pure anime logic. I mean in terms of the little girls being in charge of an entire realm. Unless they are supposed to be older than they look like, and ZUN just sucks at drawing/giving indications on how the characters should look like when he has someone else do the art (no offense towards the artists who have worked on that content, their art is actually quite good).
  9. What are the spiciest takes in regards to Touhou you may have or even believe in? It can be anything about either canon, fanon, the community, ZUN, absolutely anything as long as it is connected to Touhou. Here are some of mine, and they might be quite controversial: I have a severe dislike for the Simpsons/"Sazae-san" time logic applied in Gensokyo. It's been 20 year since EoSD, yet everything looks just as much as it did back then. Things do not change, nobody evolves, and somehow the status quo has to be maintained. Maybe I ended up disliking this kind of story-telling as a result of getting fed up by American sitcoms and animated series like the Simpsons or Family Guy, but in a way, I would greatly appreciate a series that grows up together with its audience. Gensokyo will always be ruled by small anim girls and lolis, to put it bluntly. Even if we go by the "they are youkai, and they are shapeshifters" interpretation, how does it come we have never seen them change their aspect? If you are a youkai and want yourself to be respected, do you actually believe looking like a 16 year old girl would be the way to do that? Especially when it comes to those who have the pretention to fight for the rule of Gensokyo - none of them looks very old, or at least old enough to count as an adult who is supposed to be a venerable entity hundreds, if not thousands of years old (Kanako, Byakuren, Miko, whoever else was there as a big deal in Symposium of Post-mysticism etc) ZUN has no idea how to draw something that does not look like a loli, and this is clearly not helped by his drawings looking like dolls. Sometimes I doubt he really intended any character to be drawn as an actual woman, even when he had other artists do the work for anything outside the main games. IN a way, I would really have liked to see someone visually grow up, and actually become an adult not just by age, but visually too given for how long some of the series ran. And for that, I believe Akyuu has been a little bit of a wasted opportunity. She does age up in the way that we actually know when she was born, and that she is a regular human, therefore with the chance of being affected by what we commonly call "growing up", yet at her age of 28, she still does not look older than 14. I would be OK with the explanation of her being small in stature, but the rest of her appearances do not really help. And fanart does not do a better job either. Even if we have a very clear age for her, a lot of fanart still likes depicting her the way she looked in the in the Perfect Memento in Strict Sense era (aka the early depictions). Event the latest canon depictions don't make her look like someone in her late 20s either. It's weird to see someone who is almost 30 look like a 14-16 year old girl at best. Yeah, you can blame it on stylization and how much anime style exaggerates features to look as cute as possible, but I just think sometimes the official Touhou art may not do justice when it comes to this kind of problem (also anime/manga art style going closer towards realistic proportions exists). Updated the old chart by adding ages just to show a little bit what I mean... Oh, and one more thing. Fans when drawing art of Touhou seem to only know two sizes: flat as a wood plans or mommy proportions (especially in terms of mommy milkers or or just being THICC). Where is the middle ground? You can add your own takes or answer to the ones already posted by other users. Anyway, what are your own spicy takes on the series?
  10. @Nekofire thank you for the reply! Given nobody wrote in here for a week, I ended up thinking this thread will go nowhere and I forgot about it. But you have brought some good points. A lot of the things you have mentioned remind me of this image, which despite the fact I have used in a different context (talking about Fusu), I think rather fits: "No anon, your waifu doesn't love you or as you go out with her, or go into any sort of romantic confession to a complete foreigner. No anon, your waifu will not allow or want you touch her in inappropriate places. No anon, your waifu will not beg you have sex with her" These are all coming from someone who has yet to even have the chance of even thinking what some of these things actually are (yeah, I still have to work on that aspect of my life...)
  11. Please remind me to come back with an actual, elaborate reply once I return from my journey. I would like to say more right now, but I have to go to sleep soon as I am leaving early in the morning. So see you all later. Oh, also @Reitisen, if you are interested, I did cover quite extensively the very topic you have talked about in 3 threads last year. But I am glad I am no longer the only one who is addressing the whole concept. Overall, it just looks as if we are just throwing it under the rug and make ourselves it does not exist.
  12. It seems like I am slowly coming less and less to update this thing. However, I could not skip the chance to look a little bit at some recent evolutions, and talk about them right here when it comes to LostWord. News and updates Oh boy, even talking about the things since the beginning of this year is quite the circus this time. Actually, just covering this week should be enough to give an idea what the hell is going on with the game: First of all, for the basic update news. Tomorrow, 13th January, LostWord Global shall go through one of the regular maintenance breaks followed by an update. Among the relevant things that shall be added to the game following this update: new Tewi alt - Bunny Rebellion Strategist (she's basically Paripi Koumei, let's face it) loli Yuyuko is getting her Fantasy Rebirth finally some more extra story... for the Chapter 1 Extra the Collection Prayer thing that started around New Year will continue for a bit more time more Scarlet Devil Tower floors we are getting an event rerun - the Valentines' Day event from last year About the Collection Prayer banner. It is a thing where, if you use 600 GCs, you have the chance to obtain one of the characters listed as part of that banner. Those characters can be SFES, Relic or even EFES. And there are three special banners: Attack Class banner – Reimu Hakurei (F1) Epic – Watatsuki no Yorihime (B3) Ultra Festival – Patchouli Knowledge (E1) Ultra Festival – Byakuren Hijiri (A12) Festival – Sakuya Izayoi (A6) Festival Heal & Speed banner – Yukari Yakumo (C3) Epic – Watatsuki no Toyohime (B3) Ultra Festival – Koakuma (E1) Ultra Festival – Satori Komeiji (S2) Ultra Festival – Alice Margatroid (A7) Festival – Reisen Udongein Inaba (A8) Festival Attack & Defense banner – Remilia Scarlet (L80) Relic – Reisen Udongein Inaba (B5) Ultra Festival – Hong Meiling (E1) Ultra Festival – Junko (B2) Ultra Festival – Toyosatomimi no Miko (A13) Festival – Reimu Hakurei (A6) Festival LostWord JP is getting a new Relic character announced. This time, it is another version of Youmu. If we are to go by what people are discussing, she is going to be a Support unit. Oh yeah... Meanwhile, LostWord Global got two more Epic Fes characters, in the form of two more versions of Satori and Koishi. The only difference this time is that they are wearing swimsuits and are coming from the Chapter 4 world (I think? I lost count of how many universes there are now, but they sure are from somewhere) Besides the Komeiji sisters in swimsuits, LW Global also received a retro version of Rumia. Now that I see the battle sprite of L1 (left) and A6 (right) Rumia... wow, there is almost no difference. So nanonka? "They're just rereleasing an outdated unit and giving them a modern kit. you want to actually use rumia? better roll A6 Rumia because L1 is nearly unusable in today's powercreep. Feels the same way with satori's alts too. you like satori? better hope you rolled on her alt banners because L1 satori is awful. On the bright side, it seems like alts aren't just restricted to EoSD characters or popular Touhou characters. we've seen alts for characters like Watatsuki sisters and Rei'sen. Now if only they'd distribute the alts more properly, why the hell do we need 5 Satoris? give me Shion and Tenshi alts" (u/TraditionalCycle6279) And now for the truly bad and ugly side of things. Recently, people have started to complain more than ever about Chapter 4 and the characters that are constantly getting pumped out of it without any context, and yet they are all Epic Fes banners. But I feel like a recent move has actually broken the camel's back for everyone: https://vxtwitter.com/Touhou_LW/status/1613460784213884929?t=J57yDgLrBCGvV9tMZ6BKXQ&s=19 Yes, you are seeing right. Miyoi is coming into the game, as a C3 universe character. I would like to say that the Global community... did not really receive the news very well: "PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT I'm convinced, this is an actual clown show now, like everything about this is stupid to the point of being funny. Skip every other rarity and jump straight to another Efes release right after a double Efes release 2 weeks ago and Relic Youmu. C3 for a character who doesn't even have an L1 yet, BECAUSE WE ASSUMED SHE WASN'T EVEN ON THE TABLE FOR ONE. C3 Efes for a non-combatant support character who's barely present in the story to begin with. She's a heal unit, so imagine she power creeps the beach hag, imagine she has double lock removal and has the fucking overpowered infinite buff extension that Beach Marisa and Relic Youmu have, and 'cus she's a C3 unit, 100% chance her kit is water based so her EX stage and card will be easily farmable using the beach hag yet again, and the other C3 units because we just gotta keep selling the C3 units no matter what. This is a clown show, it's gone beyond despair and wrapped around to being funny. I cannot wait for Efes Rinnosuke in 2 weeks and I can't wait for him to be the best unit in the game. THE DREAM ISN'T DEAD!" (u/Kdog8273) "Such a cheap move. They continue with trashy C3 EFES units instead of releasing long awaited units like some of the missing EoSD like Meiling. This feels like another whale bait before they actually release potent EFES again. But we will see." (u/N8falke) "SUMMER MIYOI? Before regular Miyoi? What the hell? She’s an EFes of course and either a Heal (most likely) or Technical unit" (u/WWWWWWRRRRRYYYYY) "Next Ninja: "You'll have an alternate version, but we do not grant you a playable L1 version." "Miyoi: "...What? How could you do this!? This is outrageous! It's unfair! How could a reskin be playable before the original?" "NN: "Take a swimsuit, young Okunoda." (u/Le_Charlie) "I predicted that this would happen seeing how Beach Rinnosuke was a thing. What a horrible move, at least make her a super fes and not an epic fes. Miyoi fans who have been waiting for her are forced to potentially fork over 400 pulls and 4 epic paper dolls to play her. Im already dreading what they'll do if PC-98 is ever introduced. Watch them go back to no pity units when Mima comes. Rinnosuke fans better start saving" (u/TraditionalCycle6279) "All the C3 units are gonna be Epic?. Why!? There is no reason at all for them to be epic units. Koishi and Satori are on the levels of an UFES. This game have a really weird idea of what is "Epic". Mima, Shinki and Sariel are epic, not a fanservice swimsuit that can easy be a normal costume for the L1 units. Even the mecha girls looks more epic than this and are UFES. Yukari was loved since she is broken as hell, but the rest of the beach units are a "try hard" at this point. Also, Miyoi got an alt before the L1 version got released! What's next?. A bath chapter that will add "Super Duper Epic units" that have only a towel!?" (u/ZeoOmega) "I kind of guess what is the reason for this action? Miyoi hasn't shown any of her power and Lotus Eaters is still ongoing, so I think they will wait for that before making the L1 unit for her. Instead of taking a risk of creating a unit that might contradict the future canon works, they chose a safe path that is creating a unit in their original world, which can let their imagination go wild. I don't support them about this, but I can see why they made this choice. Tbh, instead of pumping out C3 units like this, best would have been something else to shake things up a little. A15 Junko when?" (u/Eistik) "The saddest part about this is for how much global has improved upon the JP version, there isn't much they can do about this. Like I don't think they have the resources to pull a Magireco and build global-exclusive units and they have to release this eventually." (u/miyamoris_) "Another Efes is coming, and its before the L1, this game is going downhill because of "C3" units. I wouldn't call them Efes' anymore, its Cash-fes due to epic paper dolls being so scarce and grindy. The fact they are still releasing summer costumes in the winter, and the fact they made this before the L1 variant, and the fact that epic paper dolls being locked out for "10 to 5 lucky winners" is a possibility makes this game very disappointing in my own eyes right now. Soon they'll make an LFES but the paper dolls for it are barely obtainable unlike epic paper dolls." (u/Subwoofer45) "This is absolutely ridiculous. First of all, why is not L1 Miyoi released, but her C3 self gets released??? Secondly, can we AT LEAST, and I mean AT LEAST cool down from releasing too many goddamn C3 units? We keep getting other less released units to get if this is ongoing" (u/eyadkhaledd) Oh, and there is more to this. If you though I was over, it is never the case. And the community really seems to be getting pissed not just for te Miyoi part, but for the entirety of Chapter 4, from characters to the execution and very idea of the chapter itself. "This. I don't believe it's totally game breaking but, and this is a big BUT, devs are getting too focused on the new units rather than in improving the current experience while also adding more content to the main Story; crazy huh?! I forgot LW had a story since it has been months since the last update. There are many aspects, such as the tower that need to be on par with JP. I think adding more challenges, like bigger waves of more and more enemies that also get tougher, anything that keeps the game relevant and gives the player an incentive to have so many units. Devs have a nice franchise with a loyal userbase, it would definitely SUCK seeing an official Touhou game go down the route of a p2w game. Also wtf LW seriously? Only C3 Miyoi? Where's the L1 counterpart?! That really grinds my gears." (u/jazznesa) "People here haven't played greedy gachas and it shows. Also, for those that do, stop showing them your wallet." (u/Kiter27) "When units intended for fanservice became disservice also no Rinnosuke" (u/khanivorus_rex) (In answer towards u/Sylphiad, who asked why do people hate the C3 universe and its characters) "Spammed one after another. All EFES, the rarest of the dolls. Super powercrept all previous units. 2hus in swimsuits? Come on. This is the equivalent of having a "beach episode" of an anime where female protag gets grabbed by tentacles with dumb slow motion and camera angles. Or the equivalent of a hot springs episode where male protag goes into girls sauna and slips into ultra mega jiggly boobs and gets a nose bleed. It's a bloody insult to any fans of Touhou. The fact that they tried to shoehorn it in as the main story, instead of a little summer event/update is even worse. Notice how we're not getting main story updates anymore? Because it's all this beach crap." (u/PlusNature6947) "Fair, I do like beach episodes that are "Side stories" instead of it being in the main story. While I don't have any issues with regards to the C3 spam, I can fully understand why you guys are mad. I mean, if I were to be a spender, I'd be VERY mad. They could have diffused the situation, had they have been units that can be limit broken by normal paper dolls (Seriously, I have 30 of them in my inventory, send help). Powercreep is inevitable, but come on, THIS FAST?! I'm a casual player that plays for the characters, the story, the music, and their interactions, it's why I decided to go deep in the Touhou rabbit hole, but this... Not cool. Though I still won't quit, I'd like to see how they handle this though." (u/Sylphiad) "Alright so I stopped playing LW like ages ago because it was just incredibly dull and unengaging, despite having spent no small amount on getting everyone I wanted including multiple copies of MFes Reisen and blonde Reisen, so I dunno what this is about you saying they've replaced the main story with a completely different universe that's just built on whale bait limited characters. Is there like a TLDR I can get somewhere" (u/NovidasX7) But wait, there's more... "I'm surprised C3 units are the most disliked units in LostWord, I actually thought it's the loli units" (u/TFritzelagram - creator of the Kakashi News Spirit news section of r/touhou_lostword) "I mean, at least Smol Yuyuko has a compelling story behind her and isn't absurdly broken by the standards of her release. The C3 cast are all "this could have been a costume" from a design perspective, but instead they exist to powercreep everyone before them, including F1 Reimu." (u/CrescentCrossbow) "What I don't like about them is they contribute nothing, literally zero to the story. Like the only relevant units to the story (at least for now) is Beach Yukari and Hecatia (and Hecatia herself is already a stretch), while Reimu and Marisa just appeared for literally 2 scenes (and one of them being that they ran away from the danger lol), and Beach Satori and Koishi came out of nowhere. How am I supposed to like them if I don't even know who they are? And not to mention those units beat my friends to pulp via the EX challenges lmao. In contrast, we have 3 loli ver, and all 3 of them are important figures to the story. Loliko is a deuteragonist to the 2nd arc, Lolijun is a main villain (?) of the Hifuu story, and Loli Yukari (Loliri?) is being Yukari. I have no problem in their power, they are supposed to be strong since they are, well, Epic, but at least design them with the plot in mind. Imo, the only "successful" unit is Blue Reimu, since they build her up via multiple quest lines, which makes her more memorable than every other else." (u/Eistik) "C3 Hecatia just feels like a gag character (my only maxed C3 friend). And Beach Marisa does feel like an excuse to do a 17.5 version of her (my other C3 friend, and i like this excuse). Plus, all of them are on swimsuits, witch makes people think that the devs only want to squeeze money from us by getting all the horny players to spend money (works strangely well on JP, or so I heard)" (u/nonexitent_account) "It's that the swimsuits - which should be costumes, let's be real - are being pushed as the highest cost unit instead. The loli Friends all cost less, and are easier to justify as separate characters. Not to mention that the challenge content is being designed for the Epic units, so it's becoming increasingly hard to play the game without these high-cost glorified costumes" (u/GeminiMaxxim) "Ngl, at first it's interesting and good to see 2hus with swimsuits, but In time, they just keep spamming epic swimsuit units, i mean, we are in fucking Winter, and they STİLL giving us swimsuit units, it's starting to be really annoying. And most annoying part is they're all Efes units, for example if they just give a swimsuit unit in every 3 or 4 months or only summer times, it'll be good ¯_(ツ)_/¯" (u/HexyCupcake) "Yeah, the main problem, maybe as mentioned before, THEY HAD NO CONTRIBUTION TO STORY PER SE. Only 5-6 lines of speaking, no big impact on story, and BOOM. EPIC UNITS. The other thought, I wouldn't mind if lunar war character being Epic units rather than those swimsuit, story-less characters are dominating the powercreep." (u/AgitatedBlood1593) "There was an actual story reason for the Lunar War characters, weird and sometimes shameless recolors (like Alterisa and P2/Blue Reimu) and the loli characters. But the C3 variations are literally just the base cast wearing swimsuits and holding various beach equipment. I'd say the Retro units would also be a universally despised concept considering most of them barely have any visual differences from their original counterparts. But considering some of the units that were given retro variations have costumes that either completely change up their appearance or make small tweaks to the color palette, I'll let it slide. ... FOR NOW. I'm surprised the first variation units weren't the school outfits. But I guess it shows how drastically different the mindset has become for the lead devs of this game given that it's become less about telling a story with interesting characters and more about making money by milking said characters. Kinda feels like the story's more of an afterthought now instead of being the main focus. Sure we've got various challenges to keep ourselves busy, but considering one of them is on a timer for some bizarre reason and becomes inaccessible after said timer runs out and the rest require having an obscure amount of Story Cards that have abysmal drop rates and no way to increase those drop rates naturally I don't think the devs actually thought things through with this game and just did the throwing ideas at a dartboard thing that seems to happen with other games of a similar nature." (u/MysteriousBirbNukes) "A lot of gacha players are pedos, so it stands to reason they'd have a solid consumer base to market those characters to, unfortunately." (u/ThePhantomSquee) And with all this in mind, time to get to the next section of our news roundup: Community discussion and memes Some of these characters are actually new to most people. Especially since they dropped in JP, and will probably be mentioned in Global soon as well... And more discussions about MC-chan. People still really are curious to talk more about her.
  13. Made some further modifications for adding up some ideas and making reading a little easier in some sections.
  14. Oh wow, this sure is one unique way to introduce your characters into the story...
  15. I am still not 100% convinced what I would like to do next. I would still like to stay here, but I am thinking if covering the spin-offs would be worth it. Perhaps they can be a multiple feature, one for each of the games given that I may be able to sum them up in the length of a single long Amagami character introduction comment. If there is not much fanart, then it will be easy. Anyway, thank you so much for having been around, and just giving me the energy to continue this. It feels so much better to know that at least one person seems interested in what you are talking about, as it seems like you are the only persons who has interacted with the thread besides myself. In a way, I wish there was more activity in here, but I guess it makes sense not to be so many people given this is an off-topic series compared to our main focus centered around Touhou.
  16. Oh, I am definitely planning to write that thread soon. Thank you in advance for wishing to join the conversation
  17. Thank you for the contribution! Is there anything else someone else wants to add?
  18. I don't know for sure where it started from either, but I have seen lots of connections towards this image: Not the image I was originally looking for, but the Touhou wiki decided to make me the funny surprise of discovering this when reading about "ZUN's girlfriend" bit of fanon. This is what they say on the topic: "Aya has also been referred to as "ZUN's girlfriend" because of her recurring appearance in the games." The image I was actually looking for is this one (the black section might be for meme template, like with the example below):
  19. @Nekofire unfortunately, SasaMisa has not been around since last summer. We have no idea where he is (or at least I have no idea), therefore it is hard to say when he may come back and give his own point of view towards the question you addressed. Good thing however that SoundOfRaybe was here to help.
  20. And yet there are enough people who believe Len'en is trash, and nothing more than just a bad Touhou rip-off that makes itself using through the use of "pronouns" (since no character has a defined gender/they are genderless according to the Len'en wiki)... Personally, I like the idea of this alternate universe. Also, is it wrong that I think Tsubakura is the first genderless character that I actually think is pretty? I don't think I have ever said that before. I would sure be curius to see more universes of this kind being created. Perhaps should we consider Seihou be something similar, just that as a "reversed Touhou"?
  21. Happy New year everyone! After watching and reading some content recently, I have started to become very curious about the subject of rivalries between Touhou and other series. (This does not deny the fact I am quite happy the Touhou fandom is actually friends with other communities as well, probably the best example coming to my mind right now being the TF2 community) Especially since for as long as I have been in Touhou community (entered my third year), I have not seen anything serious going on. I have heard a lot about the times when some parts of the Touhou and Undertale fandoms clashed, and actually seen some of those in comments for old videos (they really feel like a time capsule reflecting the times). But there are some old, perhaps gone rivalries I have heard about, yet know too little about what happened, and would like to learn more about those times. First one I would like to ask about was apparently between Touhou and Kantai Collection (Kancolle) fans. From the very little I know, Kancolle was nicknamed something like "the Touhou killer/the series that will kill Touhou"? I would like to know what actually happened at the time, how things developed, and what is current state of the relation between the two fandoms. The second thing I was going to ask about, despite possibly not being a fandom rivalry, but really got my attention as I was writing this, is regards to a Twitter post (confirmed to be fake news - I will cover that in the following days). Apparently, Touhou has been replaced this year from the Comiket introduction booklet by Blue Archive, and that this is the only other time it happened was in 2007 (which again, was confirmed to be false). Does anyone have more context on this issue? I don't really know what is going on, how it ended up like this, and if there are any possible consequences if fandoms start acting up again. From the way that tweet was framed, it implies that Touhou was used for the booklet for a long time, and this year it was for the first time replaced by another series after a decade and a half? I would like to learn more about the topic, especially about the relation with all the series that through time were framed as "the series that will kill/overthrow Touhou". But to me, one thing is clear: you can't kill Touhou. No matter if is is no longer the most popula series or ends up getting outshined by some new sparkly thing, Touhou will continue to exist. Therefore, I would add it as a third thing that would survive a nuclear fallout, along with cockroaches and rats.
  22. "i got this new anime plot. basically there’s this high school girl except she’s got huge boobs. i mean some serious honkers. a real set of badonkers. packin some dobonhonkeros. massive dohoonkabhankoloos. big ol’ tonhongerekoogers. what happens next?! transfer student shows up with even bigger bonkhonagahoogs. humongous hungolomghononoloughongous" ~ from the famous "New Anime Plot" copypasta (oldest recorded in 2016 via Tumblr) DISCLAIMER: let's keep this civil, like we always managed to. If there is anyone not wishing to be part of this, I will try return as soon as I can with a more digestible thread, or just someone can enjoy. Originally, was planning to write about something completely different today. However, just as I was ending my courses, I received the following message on a Discord group I am part of: Since I am too curious for my own good, I went there and checked a little bit what people were talking about. And I really was not disappointed. So after I finished, then had a good nap to process everything, I have decided to finally put things together in a single thread. The video is mostly about mangaka artists who have been caught and convicted for having... inappropriate behavior towards minors (and somehow still managing to make a comeback into the industry after a light sentence), but the comment section actually evolved past that point and had a long discussion about anime and how some people perceive anime as a piece of media. Someone made a relevant list for the topics covered in this video: 0:00 Intro 2:32 Nobuhiro Watsuki 8:12 Mitsubishi Shimabukuro 13:39 Tsutaya Matsumoto 20:10 Kenya Suzumi 25:53 Hidikazu Tanaka 29:13 John Leigh 37:41 Outro Which really ties well into the topic of the original thread. It also fits quite a little bit with another thread I cam up with. I have also written quite a little bit about Touhou fans being horny (probably the spiciest discussion I ended up generating last year), generally bein me trying to understand why there are so many people who love drawing images with strong sexual content (especially when it comes to age groups that should not be depicted as such). There was not really any conclusion besides me having no power in this topic besides just not watching it, so I think the subject still remains open to debate. Normally, I am quite far from what people would call a "social justice warrior". Heck, some of my opinions might actually not be too politically correct, and so I try to keep them for myself. But at some point, I do have my own limits as well. And when there is something I consider worth talking about, I really want to address it (despite probably being like the Speaker #1,000,000 who wants to do that). But let's just get to what I was looking to put together here. We were talking of why there seems to be a hate, or at least poor reputation towards Japan and the modern media coming from Japan. Recently, @_.Mevs also talked about some of the possible negative effects of exposure to anime. I have tried to compile some of the more interesting comments and chains generated by it, and pick content relevant to the issues tackled in the original thread. This time, since there are so many users, I would probably lose count quickly of which user is who: Sample A: it seems like we are already starting with a strong topic... And from there Sample B: from Japan to the Shadman (surprisingly) Sample C: "I stepped out of watching/buying Anime in 2012. It simply was infested with degenerates and it has only gotten worse. Hell, I tried to play the new Ace Attorney, and they have an 8 YEAR OLD living with an ADULT. The ENTIRE DIALOGUE with her and her "roommate" gave off the vibe that it was pandering towards Degenerates. Playing any game for me that has any anime vibe or look to it, always make me wonder when I have to throw the game away or bleach my eyes." Sample D: "The loli degenerates and the super horny part of the anime community is what has made me be on the quieter side with my love for anime. I think it's very important as you kinda mentioned to make note that the degenerate and loli losers only make up a small portion of the anime community. Sadly they are very vocal a lot of the time so it makes them seem far greater than they are. I love anime, I have figures of my favorite characters and other trinkets and stuff. I just like to watch, laugh/cry/get excited depending on the genre and get invested in the characters and the show's world just like I would while playing a video game and then talk about it with friends/people I know on discord." Sample E: the WHAT? "It seems like most of this video is “who would ever guess that the creator of Loli Harem Steampunk Battleship series was a pervert?” Sample F: how did we get here? "The sheer sexual repression Japan experienced and still experiences to this day, is a perfect breeding ground for these..."deviations". It's kind of absurd and terrifying how their desire of sexual freedom led to some of them basically going unhinged and depraved much easier than other countries." Sample G: "Back in November or something, my friend was mentioning how he was excited for the new Roruni Kenshin anime that was announced. He also mentioned the whole stuff involving the mangaka. We're both weebs, and I'm not one to be that guy to point out the moral dilemma, but my friend is the type that has time and time again been the one to not "morally grandstand" but take the morality laced route especially with comedy and jokes. So I decided to bring up the fact that while it's fine to enjoy these works after the fact and maybe through less 'legal' means. Maybe watching/paying for a criminal's new work with his name being plastered on it, isn't the best ethical/moral take. It was humorous to see him be wishy-washy with it because I was giving him an out. He could still enjoy the manga since obviously the mangaka isn't profiting off of it with the way he was going to read it. He refused, of course I was messing with him as a joke but he refused to admit. It eventually just devolved in me messing with him by constantly saying that he was defending a known [redacted] and that's where his morals end. It's sad and chuckling inducing that my friend can take issue with certain jokes but would willingly read and potentially support a criminal's acts." Sample H: it's complicated, I think... "I feel like the main problems with anime are also things that are often problems with Japanese society as well, such as higher tolerance of pedophilia compared to most other countries. Unfortunately a lot of people defend that less savory aspects of anime and Japanese culture." Sample I: even some Japanese themselves seem to be concerned with what is going on... "I'm Japanese, and i spent middle school and first year of high school in japan. i had a lot of friends (we were all 'gyaru') and a lot of my childhood is thinking that pedophilia, r4pe and other stuff like that was normal in pornography and normal anime and manga. me and my friends used to think that, old men looking at us, licking their lips, when we walk by them on the street, was normal. just a bit weird. Japan has a very serious and big issue with romanticizing r4pe, pedophilia, minors (especially high schoolers, specifically high school girls, and so much more and its considered normal to have these sorts of things in Japanese media (games, manga, anime, tv shows, etc) (btw i censored "r4pe" cus YouTube usually takes down comments with that word :/)" Sample J: the moment when you cannot tell other people what you like due to the associations with negative cases "Sometimes I’m embarrassed to tell my peers that I’m into anime because I feel as if I would be lumped into the weirdos. The people who have a body pillow of a nude character, people who watch anime instead of showering at least once every other day, and people who go out into the middle of the road cosplaying (which I’m kinda split on) and singing openings in public. I am afraid that I will be lumped into that group as opposed to what I actually do, watch a maximum of 4-5 episodes per day, just having it as a hobby, like watching YouTube. The reason I have it as my profile picture on here is because everybody is anonymous - none of my friends, classmates, teammates, etc, - so nobody will recognize me. I think anime is cool, some have great story telling (for example, One Piece), and it keeps me really intrigued about what will happen next. Of course, I do my homework, shower, eat, and do other things before watching it and I usually watch it at night before I go to sleep. It sucks because when people ask me about my favorite movies, I always say, “probably A Silent Voice or Howl’s Moving Castle,” and I nearly always get weird looks and one time, somebody told me, “you fricken weeb,” (the actual curse word, I just don’t like cursing because I’m fairly young - under thirteen - and I don’t think I should) and it was pretty upsetting. I can’t tell people about my interests without getting weird looks, treated differently, or getting lumped in with the group I mentioned earlier. Kinda sucks TL;DR: I get embarrassed telling people I enjoy watching anime which is kind of upsetting." And just to end this thread... At one point, I was complaining about the anime art style being used so much for less than appropriate content. And it is not just among big name artists of the industry, but the small fan-artist as well. I have talked enough about percentages in terms of adult content, now it is time to actually show some evidence. I have been using Danbooru for over a year now t find new Touhou art on a daily basis. It is not the most filtered website, but in a way, the risks are worth it since there is more art on that website than other alternatives, with lots of daily updates. However, when you look at what some people draw, it becomes extremely questionable. Where am I going with this? I guess just rethreading my distaste for child-like characters used for lewd or porn situations. But just for a brief idea how that website works, I am going to posts screenshots of how the first 5 pages of the "General Room" as it looks at the time of taking said screenshots (this thing updates way too quickly, so I had some problems of keeping track with what was posted, as when I was coming back from next screenshot, Page 1 already became page 2). Everything inappropriate will be censured for the sake of decency: Normally, as I am censoring a lot of stuff, here comes the question: "Does art have limits? Should we impose any limits to art, or are we just removing our right to free expression?" IN the past, Danbooru members have said about their own website that "we are an art repository, not a place where to talk our opinions about art". Yeah, good thing your "art repository" has decided to keep all the rape, all the guro, all the incest, all the child porn, all the fetishes, the bestiality, all the unnatural and disgusting proportions, all the repetitive coomer bait, but THAT thing (any art pieces that looks remotely non-Anime style), delete it as quickly as possible or don't review it at all, it's not Japanese enough looking". I had a much better insight into a specific situation that involved Touhou art and a huge debate around it, but unfortunately I an no longer find that exact discussion from one of my previous threads. EDIT: I have found that original discussion, and it is just as bad as I remember. I will not link the art piece where this all happened, nor mention the name of the artist unless getting asked to do so. Spoiler just for the sake of common sense, and dur to some of the topics mentioned here: Interesting enough, it seems like arguments of this kind are no longer really a part o Touhou posts. Have people calmed down, have times changed, or just everyone resigned and accepted all the shit that is posted every now an then? In a way, this just makes a bad image for fanart, I will not lie. Especially when you end up, as a by-product of ignorance and still being a small series better know for its fan-works, to be mislabeled as a "hentai series" more than anything/have people's first experience with Touhou be through adult doujins (funny how when I use he word "doujin" in discussions, and that happened irl as well, people assume I am talking about hentai mange; aka the "doujin = porn" argument) I feel like this has gone quite a little bit off-topic from the original intention. However, if you could, we can turn this into a worthy continuation of the original thread. Initially, I was planning to post this merely as a comment in that thread. However, I have decided to go instead for a new thread just so we could have a fresh talk on the issues and perhaps get a better understanding of why there are so many people who believe anime and the art style itself is so problematic, if not outright detested. Just to end this on a more positive note, i will link two videos that i have found to be very interesting: https://youtu.be/CW5pIEzyeh0 (YouTube refuses the embed for some stupid copyright reasons) An evolution of animated films in Japan, from 1907 to 2020. I did not know they were doing animation films so early in the 1900s And a history of anime series from the 1960s onwards
  23. After an undefined (fantastic) hiatus, The_Entire_Circus is back at it. It went off my radar for more than a week, especially since I have barely been to Reddit. In the time since the year began, he has posted twice in what I affectionally nickname "Fusu-posting", as it seems like the posts have gone yo just one a week. Anyway, here are the posts (art used is still that of siw0n, with translated bubbles modified by the user): New Year started with the funny rat And now continues with an ice fairy
  24. Currently, my wallpaper looks like this: Thing is I am not using a single image, but a set of them. They are part of the Slide Show feature, and change every 10 minutes: My original Slide Show folder, as I used it on the previous laptop, was much greater. In time, I may gradually start adding more and more from there to diversify the current folder as well since there were some very nice images.
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