Why are Touhou fans seemingly so thirsty?

[CountVonNumenor]

So... I decided to port a condensed version of this discussion to r/touhou. As anyone might thing, it went just as well as you would imagine. From some saying the topic is quite relevant to...everything else. 8ronically, still pretty much the best thread I have ever written not just on that subreddit, but also on that god-forsaken platform. 

 

[Paracausality]

Because that's just human nature, look at how many crimes and controversies centered around sexual stuff happen on a daily basis, the saying "If it exists, there is porn of it." is not only a meme, but also astonishingly accurate, and when you give internet peeps access to a massive female cast for reference for material...

Luckily my favorite Touhou character, namely Sariel will never be a victim of this degenerate antics, and that's all that matters to me :)

Edited August 6, 2022 by Scyzer

[adzi]

On 8/6/2022 at 7:15 AM, Cardinal_ said:

Because that's just human nature, look at how many crimes and controversies centered around sexual stuff happen on a daily basis, the saying "If it exists, there is porn of it." is not only a meme, but also astonishingly accurate, and when you give internet peeps access to a massive female cast for reference for material...

Luckily my favorite Touhou character, namely Sariel will never be a victim of this degenerate antics, and that's all that matters to me :)

One quick dive on Danbooru later...

Sariel has total of 326 arts featuring her... and maybe 3 or more NSFW and several that could be considered otherwise "spicy". Out of 326.

Sheesh, your waifu is niche as heck. XD

[Paracausality]

16 hours ago, adzi said:

One quick dive on Danbooru later...

Sariel has total of 326 arts featuring her... and maybe 3 or more NSFW and several that could be considered otherwise "spicy". Out of 326.

Sheesh, your waifu is niche as heck. XD

Heck yeah! 

 

We actually don't even know what gender Sariel is, for all we know it might not have a biological gender at all, and thus is completely impossible to lewd >:). 

Edited August 8, 2022 by Cardinal_

[CountVonNumenor]

This info coming from the comments of the big Reddit thread might flip some of the data we were aware of

It is interesting to see that despite its reputation, Touhou apparently does not have so much content of the kind within its own tag, while other series go close to 50% of their fan-made cotent be NSFW.

 

Also, please let's get things straight, once and for all. I am not condemning the creation of any sort of R18 materials, since I am perfectly fine with some of them. 

Spoiler

Like this one is looking pretty cool, not gonna lie

My only thing is about people when they start acting like immature monkeys around mature stuff. Like all those people who act as if they never saw a woman in their lives. Or those who believe bland, generic, cookie-cutter video formats (there literally is a format to which you only need to insert the photos you want and voila, the video is done) with cropped Touhou hentai represent peak Touhou content.
 

I will probably not comment on POV/wish-fulfilment images like the kind Fusu creates (I really is his safe for work art, as he has not drawn anything safe since November last year). I am not familiar enough with that format, and also do not really want to anger anyone if my take on it is bad. Instead, I will link two discussions I have seen recently on both the annoying YouTube videos and wish-fulfilment art. From here, it is up to you to decide. 

 

"No anon, your waifu doesn't love you or as you go out with her,  or go into any sort of romantic confession to a complete foreigner.  No anon,  your waifu will not allow or want you touch her in inappropriate places.  No anon,  your waifu will not beg you have sex with her" 

I think this ending paragraph sums up what I feel about the general horniness of Internet users rather well to be honest. 

Edited August 15, 2022 by CountVonNumenor

[CountVonNumenor]

On 8/8/2022 at 6:51 AM, Cardinal_ said:

and thus is completely impossible to lewd

Never say that. Usually, these are the final words before someone is about to be wrong. Still hope you may be right though. R34 in itself has the following form: "if it exists, there will be porn of it, no exception", and R35 continues: "if there is no porn of it, it shall be done". 

[Vreddo]

On 5/28/2022 at 11:25 PM, CountVonNumenor said:

Basically a continuation to this thread, but from a different angle. Shifting the focus from official material to fanon material. 

This started as a simple question, but now I am slowly losing the flare to write it. However, I will try end it with whatever I can still salvage out of my mind. So, let's start. Why are Touhou fans so horny? Looking online, old discussions have always placed Touhou as number #2 or #3 online in terms of the amount of questionable or explicit content. And a good chunk of it seems to be coming from Japan alone. The brief discussion with SasaMisa and Turbonator in general chat served a warmup for what will be going on here. 

As i was saying. This whole idea to question bugged me since a few days ago. A simple walk through Twitter took me down a whole rabbit whole of questionable and explicit content based on a single artist's retweets. Basically, from a single person, you could end up creating an entire network of artists, most of them from JP. Before I am fully losing coherence, I will just expose my points as a series of ideas:

 

• I guess "porn/sex sells" like the saying has always been - I was told by a friend I would be extremely surprised how much an artist can win out of two things: porn/hentai and furry art

 

• why is there so much questionable and explicit material about child-looking characters? (not just in Touhou, but as a question in general) - I am sorry to put it so bluntly, but if Danbooru for example was to add a couple new tags, those two would be "child porn" and "fetish"

 

• why are we craving such kind of content so much? what is the appeal to such content?

 

• why is this so much of a Japan associated thing? At least from my perspective as a European, that sort of thing is utterly bizarre. If a convention or any sort of event was taking place here, with public of all ages, selling smut of any kind would have turned into a public outrage. However, when it comes to stuff like Comiket et al, it seems lie you can very easily sell such content, together with the whole concept of having doujins fully dedicated to just drawing hentai of that subject

 

• out of any franchise online, how did Touhou gain so much popularity in terms of such content? is it just because of the almost total freedom ZUN has given in terms of fan materials?

 

• did you ever had that kind of weird moment and sensation when discovering a piece of fanart you like and and is perfectly SFW actually has am NSFW version too? it feels very odd if you ask me, especially if you were only used to the safe one, and it was something you really liked

 

• despite not having a clear source for the claim Touhou is in top 3 when it comes to the amount of smut material dedicated to any franchise, i do have a source for something else - apparently, Touhou fan art is the one the gave birth to "Ahegaokin" (and more or less the meme too) through a Patchouli image; at least that is what Know Your Meme says

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Apparently the OG Ahegao

 

• going from memes to stats, I have alt least two sources - one for which I need to credit @Tenkko and one I found by chance; it comes in regards to the the amount of Touhou fan content that goes into the unsafe area on both Pixiv and the more infamous R34 (wish we also had a Danbooru/Gelbooru stat, as you could find a lot more there too)

(possibly severely outdated) R34 stats from last year in regards to Touhou content (no PC-98 stats though)

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DISCLAIMER: I DO NOT PROMOTE PORN OF ANY CHARACTERS THAT HAVE APPEARANCES OF SMALL GIRLS, this is just the numbers of lewded post that I have researched on rule34 . xxx

Rule 34 (as of June - 2021)

GAMES

Main Characters

• Reimu: 4428
• Marisa: 2503
   

6/EoSD

• Rumia: 901
• Daiyousei: 459
• Cirno: 876
• Meiling: 1435
• Koakuma: 1142
• Patchouli: 3456
• Sakuya: 3843
• Remilia: 2247
• Flandre: 2020
   

7/PCB

• Letty: 253
• Chen: 450
• Alice: 2655
• Lily: 140
• Lyrica: 95
• Lunasa: 322
• Merlin: 180
• Youmu: 2223
• Yuyuko: 1718
• Ran: 1379
• Yukari: 2742
   

7.5/IaMP

• Suika: 785
   

8/IN

• Wriggle: 387
• Mystia: 554
• Keine: 1022
• Tewi: 683
• Udongein: 3046
• Eirin: 1061
• Kaguya: 652
• Mokou: 902
   

9/PoFV

• Medicine: 40
• Yuuka: 1829
• Komachi: 761
• Shiki Eiki: 597
   

10/MoF

• Shizuha: 173
• Minoriko: 227
• Hina: 564
• Nitori: 1051
• Momiji: 2183
• Aya: 2363
• Sanae: 4046
• Kanako: 703
• Suwako: 990
   

10.5/SWR

• Iku: 625
• Tenshi: 1227
   

11/SA

• Kisume: 66
• Yamame: 342
• Parsee: 657
• Yuugi: 913
• Satori: 1879
• Orin: 1095
• Okuu: 1368
• Koishi: 1419
   

12/UFO

• Nazrin: 665
• Kogasa: 761
• Ichirin: 118
• UNZAN:9
• Murasa: 279
• Shou: 342
• Byakuren: 1158
• Nue: 790
   

12.5/DS

• Hatate: 583
   

12.8/FW

• Luna: 178
• Star: 217
• Sunny: 164
   

13/TD

• Kyouko: 272
• Yoshika: 234
• Seiga: 366
• Tojiko: 166
• Futo: 348
• Miko: 399
• Mamizou: 209
   

13.5/HM

• Kokoro: 567
   

14/DDC

• Wakasagihime: 112
• Sekibanki: 185
• Kagerou: 494
• Benben: 40
• Yatsuhashi: 36
• Seija: 142
• Shinmyoumaru: 71
• Raiko: 71
   

14.5/ULiL

• Sumireko: 86
   

15/LoLK

• Seiran: 69 (guys, please don't...)
• Ringo: 48
• Doremy: 97
• Sagume: 127
• CLOWNPIECE: 289
• Junko: 178
• Hecatia: 111
   

15.5/AoCF

• Jo'on: 45
• Shion: 72
   

16/HSiFS

• Eternity: 5
• Nemuno: 22
• Aunn: 30
• Narumi: 16
• Mai: 25
• Satono: 29
• Okina: 29
• OKINA_BUT_STANDING_UP:_probably 29
   

17/WBaWC

• Eika: 1 (GOOD)
• Urumi: 93
• Kutaka: 20
• Yachie: 45
• Mayumi: 27
• Keiki: 42
• Saki: 24
   

18/UM

• Mike: 23
• Takane: 9
• Sannyo: 5
• Misumaru: 3
• Tsukasa: 34
• Megumu: 12
• Chimata: 2
• Momoyo: 27

 

PRINT WORKS

• A/CoLA
• Rinnosuke: 171
   

B/SSiB (Lunarians stories)

• Reisen(SSiB): 43
• Toyohime: 60
• Yorihime: 115
   

C/WaHH

• Kasen: 905
   

D/FS

• Kosuzu: 124
   

E/PMiSS

• Akyuu: 179

F/LE

• Miyoi: 6

CDs

• Maribel: 127
• Renko: 180

NOTE: It seems like the final bosses weren't as popular as other earlier bosses in the same game (except for 12 because Byakuren is Byakuren). Also I know other sites exist but I don't want to make my research harder

(And the thread itself https://www.reddit.com/r/touhou/comments/px788q/statistic_about_the_number_of_rule_34_posts_of/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)

Also the Pixiv stats as offered by Tenkko + a few comments on my side

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Notice the large amounts of fairy content 

 

As for my comments on the issue. By noticing a few of the stats in that chart:

• Sanae - 13.7%
• Eirin - 13%
• Byakuren - 12.6%
• Reisen Udongein Inaba - 12%
• Ran Yakumo -11.8%
• Yorihime & Toyohime - 11.6% (each)
• Patchouli - 11.3%
• Yuugi - 10.5%
• Yukari - 10.15%
• Sakuya - 10.1%
• Aya - 10%
• Iku - 9.87%
• Raiko - 9.85%
• Keine - 9.81%
• Yuuka - 9.61%

Now time for the observations. Some of these numbers seem to be rather obvious (I will be mostly try to refer to just the fanservice kind of having undressed characters, and try stay as far as possible from anything involving intercourse unless it becomes relevant):
 

• Sanae did get some sort of "fanservice" reputation in the fandom, and I do not understand the reason why. Many people I ask refer to her as "Reimu, but fanservice", "Reimu, but with boobs" or simply as "doujin fam". Did this come to be just because of one doujin in which Sanae is called a "good girl"? Even the wiki mentions that doujin when referring to her fanon material. 
• I am not very sure how Eirin got so high on her spot, even if it is just percentage-wise. Maybe he fact she might be as old as the world and her more womanly look have been a factor to ensure people they will not just end up drawing CP? (it is not like like Eirin is usually placed in the "old ladies club" of Gensokyo)
• Byakuren is interesting. I can imagine that her biker outfit from the fighters was a boost to this, but I am not sure how far you can actually go from that towards proper R-18 material.
• Reisen is probably another one of the more (in)famous cases. I know she is a bunny girl and all, therefore fanservice and smut fuel. An for further reference, I even did get a bit into the famous "Drunkards in Eintei" doujin, from where we got the famous "I'm just a useless little bunny, only good for my sex appeal", in order to see what gave people the decision to feature her so much in smut. It is funny how one simple line in a doujin just encouraged the tendency of having Reisen featured in H-doujins and art. 
   

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Fanon at its finest, I guess. And so, the fate of a bunny among fans was sealed...

 

• About Ran Yakumo, I am not very sure what to say. Probably association with Kitsune usually shaping as attractive women? Also the fanon meme of the "suppatenko" (exhibitionist Ran)  or something...
• Yorihime & Toyohime -  I am honestly amazed they even get H-material, given how unpopular they are in the fandom. Maybe it is more about revenge stuff (not gonna mention the r-word) and that 1% made out of Fusu art (gonna get there soon)?
• Patchouli - probably coming from an interesting concept we, humans, have created - "the forbidden fruit". In this case, the principle is simple: the more clothes a character has on, covering everything, the greater the desire to see them without those clothes. This principle might work on all 2hus, given how much ZUN likes covering them with as much clothing as possible. And since Patchouli has all those robes on her...it becomes obvious.  Is this how it works, or logic leaves me on this one?
• Yuugi - really not sure what to say on her. Big buff woman, I guess?
• Yukari - the reasons seem to be obvious. However, I cannot really come up with them right now. A bit of help?
• Sakuya - a bit and not so surprising at the same time to be in the category of characters with so much "saucy" works around her. How did this come to be? Is i a mutation of the pads meme? The only one such work I know is the one about Sakuya getting stuck through a wall (typical H-trope from what I can see - how do people even manage to get half stuck into something, especially a wall?) and people doing...stuff to her. 
• Aya(yayaya) - look who fate has turned on... The one character fans tend to portray as a pervert taking panty shots has become victim herself of perversion (I am totally not paid by Hatate to say this). Anyway, interesting to see her placed so high on the top. Guess protagonist + nice design + already established fanon?
• I will place Iku and Raiko together, since what I am going to say is mostly identical. None of them is very popular in terms of character. However, it is truly a surprise to see them ranking so high in terms of percent compared to other characters. They are also in my list of favorite characters, and so got my attention. I guess Raiko still has the fact she is a redhead going for her to motivate such "artistic" works.
• Keine - seriously, what can I say about her? I really have no idea.
• Yuuka - oh yeah. Also huh, another one of the 2hus from my personal top 10 favorites. I guess her fanon depiction has become fuel for some fetishes, and so a lot of fanservice? From what I have seen on Danbooru, most of her NSFW material tends to go from 0 to 100 real quick. From very mild, to very much not suitable for life and "this is such a bad day to have eyes".

 

• Also finally, there is this little thing (I cannot believe I had to rely on XE3G weeb for the info, despite how much I hate him as the creator of the "I want mommy" meme format and basically a huge liar). This is, at least from reading the comments, what happens when you let a hentai doujin try to do a safe-for-work project (game is Touhou Shoujo - Tale of Beautiful Memories)  Curiosity propelled me into the uncharted waters of live sex chat, where every encounter promised a thrill of the unknown. Behind the screen, I found a diverse community of individuals free live sex seeking connection and exploration. Conversations ranged from the sensual to the explicit, each interaction a tantalizing dance of anticipation. In this digital playground, inhibitions fade, and fantasies take flight, offering a glimpse into a world where boundaries blur and desires reign supreme.

 

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The comments, knowing this dude and the kind of audience he brings in, are not so much of a surprise.

 

Honestly, I am not so sure why I am bothering so much anymore. I only end up looking like a failed crusader trying to have a failed fight against something I cannot defeat. But I think the simples thing would just be to sit down, relax and embrace the fandom with whatever it brings in, safe or not, in good or poor taste. But I am still curious though. It is almost pathological for me to ask questions about stuff I do not understand or might have a different opinion about. So yeah, this is the new direction in which the original thread is going. Since this is also basically some sort of fanservice, just of the more innuendo type. 

Yeah, it's hard to argue with that, thanks for sharing.

[CountVonNumenor]

I was not expecting to see this thread resurge, but uts nice to see some of my older posts alive again