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How does aging and ages work like in Touhou?


CountVonNumenor

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On a similar model to the Akyuu post from yesterday, I am bringing another charter I have done long ago. I made it in order to keep count with the depictions of Youmu in official material, and now that I mentioned different artist and inconsistency, I think it would fit perfectly. 

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In this case, an evolution is not really visible, and Youmu seems to be remaining the same age (with some hiccups that make her younger), and the fact there are quite different styles and artistic liberties does not help proving any thesis whether characters grow up or not. 

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  • 1 month later...

I believe you’re now tried of my canon jokes so, without beating around the bush, I’ll be closing the gap between the 17, 17.5 and 18. (Oh ho ho, PC-98 is going to come to the table but It will take time.) Without further ado:

 

Touhou 17 - Wily Beast and Weakest Creature

=============================================================================================================

Eika Ebisu: She is a spirit of stillborn. (Roughly 24 weeks) and her name is maybe related to one of the 7 fortune gods of Japan. But not much is known about her; if we calculated her years in hell which will be translated to many thousands of years in human world although she is not here in Sanzu river long as she has only lived a few years as her soul wouldn’t be that old yet. So, I’ll say century with 24 weeks added to it.

 

Urumi Ushizaki: An Ushi-oni whom likes to tend to the ancient fish of Sanzu, as of now, Edo Period only comes into my mind (There’s a folklore based on the San’in Region which is her origin but I don’t think it’s the time for it yet, hey Von I don’t mind if you create a folklore thread) 

 

Kutaka Niwatari:  God have existed long ago and being a gatekeeper in hell must make you pretty old hmm… you know the drill.

 

Yachie Kicchou: Another Yakuza boss… alright now, chinese dragon-turtle who is millennials old.

 

Mayumi Joutouguu: A clay figure who has won over my feelings as the haniwa warrior she goes back to Kofun Period 300 to 538 AD add a bit more clay life and that’s done.

 

Keiki Haniyasushin: Haniyasu-hiko can stand with the lunar sage as she is linked with Goddess Izanami.

 

 Saki Kurokoma: Prince Shoutoku’s (Miko) horse and earlier than 547 AD. (Why I need more info on her)

 

Touhou Gouyoku Ibun

===================

Yuuma Toutetsu: One of the four evil creatures of China. (Mainly origins as I’m quite lost) millennials old as they’re often represented in Shang (1766-1046 BCE) and Zhou dynasties (1046–256 BCE).  

 

Unconnected Marketeers

=============================================================================================================

Mike Goutokuji: Lucky cat…. Well no lucky me since I don’t know if she works like the bake-neko if not probably decades old.

 

Takane Yamashiro: Yamawaro another kappa’ cousin this time she is younger than Nitori, I just have a hunch (Younger than most yokais)

 

Sannyo Komakusa: Another purple head, alright off you go with Nemeno. (On my eyes, She seems older than her) 

 

Misumaru Tamatsukuri: Her origin stated that she (he) is an ancient jewel maker; also the setting is perfect. (It’s a shame she will get buried even as we’re talking)

 

Tsukasa Kudamaki: I only see one tail.

 

Megumu Iizunamaru: Cunning like a bird riding a for and She is older than that fox and the news reporting pigeon bird.

 

Chimata Tenkyuu: Another special god whom belief were lost by us. One of the vivid ones that is still colorful even in millennials.

 

Momoyo Himemushi: I’ve heard of this folklore, it’s very good and Fujiwara no Hidesato slaying a ginat-centipede? That goes back to Heain period. (794-1185)

 

At long last, my bull filling half-a-ed post has been done and with that, this has deviated from the original title of this thread; my apologies for this shabby as a hut post about age. And with my promise to a fellow enthusiast has been paid back. How do I feel after completing this one? Mildly joyful. Two days seems like along time for me and pardon for that and a bit of a let down.

 (Pc-98 and other spinoff characters are going to be a hassle)

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Truly is Yin & Yang. 

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honestly the only characters i can think of that has a actual explanation to looking young is tewi and mamizou.

 

here me out; what are two things we know about tewi:

1: she's the inaba white rabbit

2: she like to play pranks

in my mind, tewi looks young in order to better hide from humans so she can do her pranks more often, after all a innocent looking child is going not be noticeable to people who got pranked and are inconvenienced while getting laughed at

 

as for mami, simple she's old, she knows it and looks young because she don't want to be reminded of her old age

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On 5/25/2022 at 8:20 PM, Gou the frog said:

Mayumi Joutouguu: A clay figure who has won over my feelings as the haniwa warrior she goes back to Kofun Period 300 to 538 AD add a bit more clay life and that’s done.

Nice to see this series coming back with more age guess-timations. There is one thing I wonder about Mayumi though. I know Haniwa clay figures come from the Kofun period. However, are we sure Mayumi was created back then, or she is a more recent creation of lady Keiki? Also, since she is supposed to a an army commander, therefore a smart/cunning, strong, imposing and charismatic figure (at least that is how I would imagine an army commander of the ancient/medieval world), wouldn't Mayumi be modelled after a more mature female figure? It would be strange if your army was led by some 14 year old looking girl. besides, i wonder if a Haniwa can even age, or aging comes more from how old the statue itself is...

 

On 5/25/2022 at 8:20 PM, Gou the frog said:

Yuuma Toutetsu: One of the four evil creatures of China. (Mainly origins as I’m quite lost) millennials old as they’re often represented in Shang (1766-1046 BCE) and Zhou dynasties (1046–256 BCE). 

I did not known China also has this element of the four evil creatures. I first heard it from the Japanese folklore (though I forgot who the characters were), but I can imagine the idea could have been taken from China during early history (just like other cultural elements). 

 

On 5/25/2022 at 10:10 PM, Darksymphony777 said:

honestly the only characters i can think of that has a actual explanation to looking young is tewi and mamizou.

 

here me out; what are two things we know about tewi:

1: she's the inaba white rabbit

2: she like to play pranks

in my mind, tewi looks young in order to better hide from humans so she can do her pranks more often, after all a innocent looking child is going not be noticeable to people who got pranked and are inconvenienced while getting laughed at

 

as for mami, simple she's old, she knows it and looks young because she don't want to be reminded of her old age

I mean yeah, for those two it makes quite a lot of sense. For anyone else (mostly), not really honestly. And this goes back to the rather poor artistic interpretation in official material, only perpetuated by the rest of the official artists an in turn by the fans. I mean I did not show the chart of Youmu representation in official art for nothing. She seems to become younger/lolified with each artist as time goes by, especially in the non-ZUN art. 

As a side note: I did that chart when Youmu was still my #1 on the list of favorites. I might create a new one for Akyuu too. To see if it is just as bad/inconsistent/unclear if she looks the supposed age or she doesn't (especially since she's the only 2hu that has actually grown through time, at least in theory). 

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9 hours ago, CountVonNumenor said:

Nice to see this series coming back with more age guess-timations. There is one thing I wonder about Mayumi though. I know Haniwa clay figures come from the Kofun period. However, are we sure Mayumi was created back then, or she is a more recent creation of lady Keiki? Also, since she is supposed to a an army commander, therefore a smart/cunning, strong, imposing and charismatic figure (at least that is how I would imagine an army commander of the ancient/medieval world), wouldn't Mayumi be modelled after a more mature female figure? It would be strange if your army was led by some 14 year old looking girl. besides, i wonder if a Haniwa can even age, or aging comes more from how old the statue itself is...

Well, my guess might be off but I love your idea about being created recently but if so, Lady Keiki had been fending off those noisy beasts sprits by herself and the garden so I will give another guess, she is younger than the Konfun period somewhere in between actually as I'm not so sure if Haniwa can even age. Very good point that you made, I'm interested in whether her age depends on the statue age or it is on the material's age.

 

9 hours ago, CountVonNumenor said:

I did not known China also has this element of the four evil creatures. I first heard it from the Japanese folklore (though I forgot who the characters were), but I can imagine the idea could have been taken from China during early history (just like other cultural elements). 

Japan has three (An oni, a tengi and a kitsune) and China has four ( Hundun. Hundun, Taotie, Taowu and Qiongqi) Japan and China they are somewhat like pals back in the ancient times and Korean also have their own variant of Kitsune.

 

9 hours ago, CountVonNumenor said:

(especially since she's the only 2hu that has actually grown through time, at least in theory). 

(Akyuu has the most consistent age in this series)

Edited by Gou the frog
Why must you delete my pervious text Moriya?
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Truly is Yin & Yang. 

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6 hours ago, Gou the frog said:

Japan has three (An oni, a tengu and a kitsune) and China has four ( Hundun. Hundun, Taotie, Taowu and Qiongqi) Japan and China they are somewhat like pals back in the ancient times and Korean also have their own variant of Kitsune

From what I can remember after watching Linfamy, the Japanese ones were, not in a particular order, Shuten-douji (aka the Oni that inspired the creation of Suika), Emperor Stoku (hope I got his name right; I think he became a sort of vengeful spirit or something), Tamamo no Mae (the kitsune), and I did not know there was a Tengu too.

 

6 hours ago, Gou the frog said:

Well, my guess might be off but I love your idea about being created recently but if so, Lady Keiki had been fending off those noisy beasts sprits by herself and the garden so I will give another guess

We now do not really know for certain which one was created first: Mayumi or the Haniwa army itself. Because if it was the latter, and Mayumi would be much "newer", then the army lacked a commander for a while. But yeah, the whole story can be quite fun to think of. 

 

6 hours ago, Gou the frog said:

(Akyuu has the most consistent age in this series)

As I promised. I said I will create a charter for Akyuu, and that is exactly what I did, damn it:

Akyuu_evolution.png

Still a rather visually obvious growth, yet still not enough to loo like the implied canon age of 27-28. 

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  • 10 months later...

First of all the design can help guessing the car of the character, like long dress are more likely to be worn by adult women rather than kids like, I can’t imagine Yukari as a 5 year old… the glove and all makes her design more suitable for a mature woman

Then, the way they speak or if they are mature or not, like Cirno, she’s quite immature so she can’t be an adult 

After that there’s the influence of others perception of Touhou girls age as Alphes or the anime Memory of Phantasm 

And finally, ZUN’s email where he states officially how old Touhou girls looks like, sadly, there’s only the EoSD and PCB characters

Above 15 years old : Sakuya, Meiling, Yukari

Fairly "tall" (12 to 15 years old) : Reimu, Yuyuko, Alice, Letty, Ran

Fairly "short" (10 to 12 years old) : Marisa, Youmu, Patchouli, Lunasa, Merlin

Under 10 years old : Remilia, Lyrica, Chen, Cirno, Rumia, Flandre

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I both like and hate the whole Touhou aging debate. I hate it because there is a very simple and somewhat disappointing answer that ZUN himself has stated before, yet people still debate over it. But I like it because most people don't know what that answer is, yet I do. I prefer to watch the world burn than do anything about it though, so don't expect an answer out of me hehe.

Akyuu is an interesting outlier, though. It is nice how a human with a given birthdate is made to age with the series, although something might happen since this reincarnation's time is almost up. However, I would like to address another piece of media where certain characters age while others do not: The Simpsons. As far as I know, and correct me if I'm wrong, Apu's children have grown while everyone else is pretty much the same. Just a comparison to something similar.

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