Jump to content

Thoughts on the current Touhou Fandom, or what I know of it


Tenkko

Recommended Posts

 I've voiced my thoughts over some fandom things across several threads so I'll summarize, adding some new things along the way.

The Absolute State of the Touhou Fandom
by a rambling lunatic

Overview

I still hold that the general state of the fandom is good. There's lots of content going around, with more popping up every day, and the general atmosphere is rather nice specially in smaller circles. Occasionally you see a very loud person or group come to attention, but that's quickly forgotten and it's very easy to ignore.

If we're talking about the popularity of Touhou, it's still a very niche thing this side of the world and my prediction is it will continue like that unless ZUN goes all in into commercialization. Which I doubt will happen. Not to mention the genre of the games is also not very popular and kinda hard to get into. And I know not everyone likes Touhou for the games but what I'm getting at is that at its core, Touhou is a videogame series.

Everything said I do think the community will continue to grow and I think that growth is an overall good thing, even if the rats are out there. I don't think it will ever reach the "mainstream", if you wanna call it that.

Feedback Loop

First of all let's talk about the obvious feedback loop with the older games that's always been a thing (particularly with EoSD), where people discover Touhou through works about the old generations and gain a preference for it, making more content or promoting it in some other way, which makes it more prevalent and easier to find. Other people find Touhou through it and the cycle repeats.

Is that a problem? Yyyyyyyyes and no. Over-saturation is a real issue and you can tell just by looking at the tag counts on different sites. You could argue that those games have been out for longer so of course there's more content and that's true BUT, I think the graph is still way too skewed. That said I also don't think it's a problem because, even if there's comparatively more content about the older generation of games, there's still plenty to be found of the newer ones. I get that it brings a lot of "Why do we keep reusing the same old characters instead of making more stuff about the newer characters?" but, I think that will come in due time.

I could go on a bit more about this but it's not relevant to the topic, so I'll stop here.

Fanon

The spicy meatball.

So fanon. What's up with that? The way I see it people tend to be very open to fanon interpretations and headcanons and such, often under the caveat that it doesn't ruin the image of the character. Which I take to mean two things:

  1. It doesn't stray too far from canon, personality wise

  2. It doesn't turn them into a walking stereotype/trope

The first one is completely subjective since I hold that no one has a clear idea of what true canon is, me neither. Not to mention characters can sometimes be a little bare specially when concerning the more minor ones.

The second one is most of why there's a general dislike towards the older fanon and memes nowadays, specially the ones that go into inappropriate territory. I can't speak for Japan and I certainly wouldn't want to give the wrong idea so don't quote me on this, but over there it seems there's much less resistance towards uh, “spicy” stuff. As for the tame ones it's kinda 50/50, some hate it some... may not love it but they enjoy it occasionally.

Now does that hurt the image of the series? Eh, I don't think it's as bad as people say. Like I found Touhou through MADs and YTPMVs, went directly to the canon and quickly learnt “Hey most of what I saw is... just not true. But it's funny sometimes”. And I think that's the key here. You might say "but Tenkko, not everyone's gonna do the same thing you did". True. Not everyone's gonna look that deep but they will look after a certain point. And a small look is often enough for someone to decide if they like something or not. Now if they end up preferring fanon over canon that's, up to them. It's the whole "primary fan vs. secondary fan" discussion, it's dumb as hell.

Whew. Also lots of shipping. I know that's always been a thing not only here but in the Jp fandom as well, but I just feel you see it more often on this side.

Shitposting

I've seen the Youtube shitposting it's uh... it's something. It definitely wasn't there years ago and like others said, I think the fumo boom specially had a lot to do with its rise. It's definitely not a complaint unique to the Touhou fandom of course, but it's understandable that it causes worry.

Does it give Touhou a bad image? Perhaps. I don't really hang around that part to be honest so I couldn't tell you. I'd gauge it's the same as my previous point about fanon.

Shitposting comes and goes with the wind, but it's an ever-present force and there's... nothing that can be done about it.

(also back in my day shitposting was better)

Western content

Well there's obviously lots and lots of western content, mostly in the form of artwork and, to a lesser but still considerable degree, fanfiction. But it's true that outside of that it's very sparse and unlike the Jp fandom, there's very few people who dedicate all or most of their attention to Touhou.

I think it has to do with two things: first what I discussed at the very beginning, Touhou is not very big here. Second, which is related, is that people are just not that dedicated on the west, you only see it with like very big multimedia franchises, meanwhile Japan has a whole market for doujin products that's not limited to “very general conventions” (I know doujin doesn't only refer to derivative works, but that's what we're talking about here).

There's also the area of essays and just general talk which doesn't really happen much at large scale, but that's slowly changing. I personally have been running a Tumblr blog that showcases fanworks and have plans to get into streaming. Which is also another empty area, AspreyFM is basically the only consistent Touhou streamer (that isn't limited to the main games).

There's also that old /jp/ idea that "everything western is bad" which is obviously not true. It's not very common nowadays but still pops up on occasion.

Anways, I'll put some creators and works I know that I didn't see mentioned:

Spoiler

- +TEK (plustek): not Touhou focused but has done a few arrangement albums in a really nice FM style

- ShinkoNet/NetCavy: again not strictly Touhou focused, but known for some great Eurobeat arrangements among other stuff

- asi14: straightforward PC98 arrangements, they're nice.

- Paradise of Boundaries: a mostly hispanic community. They have done some music arrangements and are currently working on a fangame

- Potemki11: made Udongein X, a very polished Megaman X clone with Reisen, and seems to be working on an SMT style game starring Sumireko

- Servants of Harvest Wish and Sapphire Panlogism: two really good danmaku games

- Cross the Boundaries: one I found about recently. It's a horror game about the Hifuu girls, very reminiscent of RPGMaker games of yore. Still in development but has a pretty good demo.

Touhou Wiki

I'm not gonna go for too long about this but I think it's worth mentioning. Everyone knows the Touhou Wiki has problems, and I'm not talking about the stuff like the recent incident where someone got too heated. There's a lot of information there that's very biased or just outright incorrect, which is... pretty bad for the place that's supposed to be the main source of information about the series.

This image was circulating a while ago and it's not even an exaggeration at this point.

Spoiler

https://64.media.tumblr.com/1b28c52ff2b5cffd143d98ed910929b8/b20fecf16f6485ac-f0/s640x960/4e31e4b876076a050fe32c54b7a77932829500a5.png

Social Media

Ough.

I don't wanna say anything specific on social media because that's... difficult, and I don't wanna get put on a watchlist, so I'll just give my vague experiences.

I spent most of my years on Tumblr, starting around 2013, and the fandom there has gone from "very active" to "still there but relatively quiet" nowadays. I made a Twitter account at the end of last year and, my experience there has been... "Please I only wanna look at art". Twitter is very loud. And I don't mean that exclusively in a negative way, but it's just. Too much.

I've never been on Reddit, I just sometimes go there to peruse some things. That's it.

DMCA and general doomposting

Don't have much to say here but I should mention it. General negativity towards the future of the series is not a new thing, it's a very very quiet voice but it's been there for a while, often about the direction that Touhou's been going in and the quality etc etc. You know the "Touhou is dying" crowd. I think there's some valid points to be obtained from that sector but overall I think it's an exaggeration.

That's one of the reactions I've seen towards the DMCAs as well, the others being a "general compliance but it's kind of a bad move", and "this is a good thing and people should stop complaining". There's a lot of people that got on that high horse which honestly surprised me (the recent PC98 thing seems to have turned some stomachs though). But that aside, the biggest takeaway for me is that there's clearly a demand for Touhou content here.

Closing thoughts

Pretty much what I said at the beginning. Fandom is growing and will continue to grow and that's good. Will it ever be as big as it is in Japan? I highly doubt it, because like I mentioned it's not only a question of how popular Touhou is, but also the lack of a real uh, "culture" around derivative content that Japan has. Maybe I'm completely wrong about that latter part but that's what I've seen after all this time. I've also noticed quite a few people that know at least something about Touhou, be it characters, music or even just the name. But that's not here nor there.

Anyways that's all. Anything I missed? Any point you disagree with? Do you have ideas on how some things could change? Different predictions? Am I just completely insane? Please let me know.

 

Edited by Tenkko
Forgot to change "three things" to "two" after I made some changes. whoops.
  • Like 4
  • Thinking 1
  • Thanks 1

everything is just peachy tonsh.gif.0b4075faabf61d7265e5c3fea342964f.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would really like to see the "lots of content going around", I really do. I'm not talking about fanart, since its kind of the only thing that wouldn't die, but rather, remixes, animations, etc... I feel like its so few and far in between that the only thing I'm left with is the really loud people on twitter, or the tons of shitposting in youtube that have not made me smile in months, due to being overused to oblivion. However, although not related with 2022, the notion of "western BAD" always left me with a bad taste, as if people thought that the japanese fandom didn't carry the same sort of weirdos that the west could have.

Discord is still better though, It is like a safe haven from all of this I just mentioned, can't actually begin to describe how much the servers I'm in helped me indirectly from quitting the fandom. I didn't know where to mention the fangames above, since I have seen a project I'm quite interested in, but its a bit hard to find them.

Also I have never seen that picture before, always thought the wiki was kind of "reliable". Oh well... That incident was quite initiated over nothing.

Don't mind me. Just ranting since I had the chance.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I will mind you because you reminded me of a couple things.

I know it seems contradictory me bringing all that up and then saying "the fandom is good" but honestly most is just, very small things in the grand scheme of things. If I just stayed with general Twitter I would've also said "yeah the fandom sucks ass lol". But I agree that it's better to hang around in smaller communities.

Alright so I forgot to mention the elitism over the games. Why? Because I don't see it that often nowadays, it's more a thing of the past I think. Easy mode is not a crime anymore, you're not labeled a phony for not doing blindfolded NMNB Lunatic clears with a steering wheel. Or even just not playing the games at all, that's fine. It's mostly a joke now. Mostly.

Western stuff. Well, I did say lots of artwork, fanfics (like 90% about ships), everything else here and there. That's honestly what I see from other fandoms too, even bigger ones. And I realize the situation with Touhou is unique even in Japan, but I still attribute part of it to there already being an established culture around derivative content. That said, I do think we could see more elaborate stuff from the west in the future.

Things I haven't mentioned are the game jams, zines that pop up once in a while, and on Tumblr someone runs a yearly event called "Gensokyo Festival" which gives prompts for a month and encourages people to make content (still mostly art).

 

 

everything is just peachy tonsh.gif.0b4075faabf61d7265e5c3fea342964f.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tenkko, it seems like you have summed up the topic quite well. Got through a lot of interesting points, and have put togethers bits of info coming from various, scattered thread of recent weeks. There are a few things I would like to add, either as additional info or personal takes on the issue:

 

8 hours ago, Tenkko said:

I can't speak for Japan and I certainly wouldn't want to give the wrong idea so don't quote me on this, but over there it seems there's much less resistance towards uh, “spicy” stuff. As for the tame ones it's kinda 50/50, some hate it some... may not love it but they enjoy it occasionally.

Yeah... this one seems to be a Japan thing at least. They really like drawing "spicy" stuff, if the two of us refer to the same kind of "spicy". I do not fully understand the appeal of it, even on the more tame ones, or why do the subjects drawn have to look like children many times. I am very sure such media in any other form would get you into jail anywhere else in the world...

Also a bit of a side note: whenever I see Touhou fan art, especially coming from Japan, I have the feeling those artists only have two (cup) sizes: flat as a wooden plank or full-on "mommy milkers" (sorry for my French). As for drawing the 2hus in adult forms, maybe this is just due to exposure to Danbooru, but it seems drawing them as adults is done like 80-90% of the time just in order to justify drawing smut. 
 

 

9 hours ago, Tenkko said:

I don't wanna say anything specific on social media because that's... difficult, and I don't wanna get put on a watchlist, so I'll just give my vague experiences.

Luckily, I only got a Twitter account for watching art (I hate that I had to make one just to visit a page to begin with...). So I can express anything for you if you are looking for. As for any other social media, outside Discord I basically do not exist with how low my presence is. So, I would like to contribute with some spicy meatballs I have found too: 
 

Spoiler

Exhibit 1: this https://twitter.com/Linmiee/status/1501509860541800449/photo/1

So... this is a regular exchange in terms of a simple question, which to be fair was put in a blunt way. For context: Linmie is a Brazilian artist. She likes drawing various stuff, among which Touhou characters. From his drawn characters, one that usually draws some attention (both positive and negative) is her interpretation of Reimu. Her Reimu has a darker skin complex, as if she is very tanned or from Central America. And when someone asked why is she drawn as such, the entirety of Twitter jumped to defend the artist with the following. Prepare some popcorn, this is gonna be interesting:
 

Quote

weebs when they see a character drawn 0.005% darker than a sheet of A4 paper [could not load the GIF - but it is heart attack related]

 

Quote

I just saw the original post, I'm... I'm dumbfounded at how this guy got so angry over it. Like this is the kinda guy who would defend white washing with "it's just a really bright light source" yet is getting angry when Reimu's skin tone is a shade darker than cream cheese

 

Quote

Toehoe fan when different skin color [MariSad image]

 

Quote

I don't know why people have to complain when a character is drawn in a different skin tone. Like if people want to draw characters in a different skin tone they can

 

Quote

Seems like racists never heard of artistic interpretations when it comes to skin colors but only excuse it when it comes to whitewashing. Everything else is free game for them though (I posted this under the wrong tweet, sorry about that).


The image from which the whole argument started: 
spacer.png

In a way, I am a bit puzzled of how the West works nowadays in terms of their double-standard moralities. And I am saying this from the perspective of an Eastern European. For us, when we look at the West and see them argue over stuff like political correctness and social justice, we are looking at them like on aliens, especially since here nobody is too bothered by such problems. But to be fair, we have higher problems here right now, including the classic "Current objective: Survive", so nobody is interested in discussing representation when you barely have enough money to get by on a daily basis and everything is becoming more and more expensive.

But back on the topic. It connects to another weird thing that only seems to be going in the Western world. In short: whitewashing bad (looking at you, John Wayne playing Genghis Khan), while blackwashing does not exist, or if it exists, it is good. Very much reminds me of a trend I was hearing about in recent years about "fixing art". And by ""fixing"", it usually refers to adding dark skin complexion to characters established as white, adding body mass ("fat pride" is a thing, apparently). Oh god, am I just racist by now by not agreeing with these trends?

spacer.png

Sorry for this going a bit too political, I usually blame it on the influence from currently being a Political Science student, first bachelor year. 

 

Spoiler

Exhibit 2: you have mentioned the wiki problem, but I think it became even more stupid after the person who started it went online and started complaining. I think it also connects even in the slightest with what you were talking about. And yeah, I am gonna bring in the one with the guy getting too heated up (I am sorry, I think it should be mentioned though for a proper analysis). I will only let this here, since it says everything much better than I ever could: 


My honest opinion: I am OK with ships. I do not care very much for them, but also do not hate them. And sometimes, I just found cute art on the topic, which I appreciate. But to complain about an edit, then drag the whole situation to Reddit and Twitter? That is a little too much. And in connection to Exhibit 1 from earlier, I just hope the Twitter denizens will not come up with anything stupid...


Alright, time to go further.
 

9 hours ago, Tenkko said:

I spent most of my years on Tumblr, starting around 2013, and the fandom there has gone from "very active" to "still there but relatively quiet" nowadays.

I have never used Tumblr, and only knew it for its overall bad reputation. However, one thing Touhou related that I saw in there and I liked is the Ask the Scarlet Sisters blog. It was some interesting blog written from the PoV of Remi and Flan, answering various questions from people in drawn/short comic form. it was nice, but unfortunately got discontinued long ago. 

 

9 hours ago, Tenkko said:

There's also the area of essays and just general talk which doesn't really happen much at large scale, but that's slowly changing. I personally have been running a Tumblr blog that showcases fanworks and have plans to get into streaming.

Oh, this is actually very interesting. I'd like to find out more about it. 




And now, to answer to White L as well. 

8 hours ago, White L said:

I would really like to see the "lots of content going around", I really do. I'm not talking about fanart, since its kind of the only thing that wouldn't die, but rather, remixes, animations, etc...

This is the general feeling I am getting about our Global/outside Japan fandom. If there is anything good, there is too little of it, and it will be covered too quickly by something easy, but easy to produce on "industrial scale". Maybe we are just not as dedicated as a whole to create as much content, and I am not sure what would make us get out of such a state. However, if us, the Westerners, did it with the Toby Fox games, it sure should be possible for Touhou too. 

 

9 hours ago, White L said:

However, although not related with 2022, the notion of "western BAD" always left me with a bad taste, as if people thought that the japanese fandom didn't carry the same sort of weirdos that the west could have.

I absolutely do not deny the fact that the JP fandom has its own flavors of degeneracy and low quality content. I already addressed that at the beginning of this reply. However, I feel that in Japan, there is simply too much good content, or at least enough to cover the bad parts. With the Western fandom, the situation seems to bet the very opposite. Or maybe the image of "Japanese fandom cannot do anything bad" was also helped in creation by how their content got in the West. To my knowledge, most of the "golden age content" was originally uploaded on NiciNico Douga, and not YouTube. However, starting with like 2008, people like reddevils500, Suika Ibuki and Moriya Salesman have started re-hosting videos from NicoNico to YouTube. In this process, I can imagine they have picked either the more popular, famous or quality products JP had, and so we got access in the West to the better products. I really am curious how much stuff actually remained on NicoNico, and how deep of an iceberg would it make in terms of fame and quality of the products



Anyway, thank you both for bearing with my rambling, hope it has brought even the tiniest contribution to the greater image of what is going on. 

  • Like 3

spacer.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OH I was in the middle of writing that reply up there lol. Anyways let's go.

4 minutes ago, CountVonNumenor said:

Yeah... this one seems to be a Japan thing at least. They really like drawing "spicy" stuff, if the two of us refer to the same kind of "spicy". I do not fully understand the appeal of it, even on the more tame ones, or why do the subjects drawn have to look like children many times. I am very sure such media in any other form would get you into jail anywhere else in the world...

The "spicy" I was referring to was the more uh... "inappropriate" jokes? You know boob stuff and the sort, anime shenanigans.

As for the other stuff... the general consensus is "don't draw children in... yeah" and "aging up characters is fine". From what I heard the first one is also a problem in Japan but people tend to look the other way. So basically the same as here. There's probably more to it but I'm not qualified to talk about a country I'm not part of.

About those two things

Spoiler

Alright. I'm from Argentina btw lol. I know about Linmie, she was originally on Tumblr actually but left due to also getting hate over her art iirc (I don't think there's anything wrong with it mind you).

I personally think it's ok to draw characters however you want. Some people get a bit aggressive about it but eh whatever. The whole thing about "fixing art" is dumb though and, if it's still happening I honestly don't keep up with it. From what I know it was about making them less sexualized, more than anything else. Linmie's case isn't any of that, to be clear.

Uh. People say whitewashing is bad because it hurts diversity, and it happens on a larger scale as well, while the opposite is not a problem because it... barely happens really. It's a complex subject that I can't really talk about.

 

About that Reddit post. Let me tell you first I think I know who the person that made it is from other sites, and honestly I can never take them seriously because of how much they reach for their conclusions. I won't say the name, just that they are obsessed with these topics.

Shipping is nice, I don't particularly seek it out but I find it cute when it comes up. Touhou doesn't have canon ships but that's not the point here. Question is does Touhou allude to relationships? Uh... maybe? Sometimes? But a lot of the examples they give are just... "yuyuko carrying an exhausted satori" what. Most of the pics in that imgur too mean absolutely nothing to me.

But people on both ends overreact when talking about relationships. Who cares.

I don't know what goes on in the wiki though so... yeah. I've heard that the person who made the comment had some past incidents as well, so there's that.

About Tumblr. Yeah I, I know about the bad rep. More a thing of the past really, people in there make fun of it too.

There used to be a lot of ask blogs and RP blogs like the one you mentioned, now that has pretty much vanished. I never really participated but seems people had a fun time. Nowadays in comparison to say, Twitter, there's much less stuff regarding Touhou. Most is western artists, with only a few Jp ones. And shitposting. Which I used to participate in years ago lol, now I just kinda maintain that account because it's stuck as my main one. Anyways the one I mentioned is here: https://gensokyo-dreams.tumblr.com/

  • Like 2

everything is just peachy tonsh.gif.0b4075faabf61d7265e5c3fea342964f.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, nice to see you again. Some clarifications:
 

1 hour ago, Tenkko said:

The "spicy" I was referring to was the more uh... "inappropriate" jokes? You know boob stuff and the sort, anime shenanigans.

As for the other stuff... the general consensus is "don't draw children in... yeah" and "aging up characters is fine".

Yeah, I was going for the...really spicy stuff. The "just don't draw children" stuff (seriously, wtf is wrong with people; it is not that us, Touhou fan, are called pedophiles for nothing). In a way, boob jokes and anime tropes no longer phase me. Annoying? Maybe. Something I would like to go to war and see purged? No, not really. 

(I am also totally not looking at how to insert a bit of talk on fan service, including some where specific parts of Memories of Phantasm fan anime. But since it is a fan-made product, such blatant fanservice is easier to forgive. I think it fits the context I have opened)

Which reminds me of something I forgot to write about in the initial comment. Until now, in over one a half years of Touhou exposure, at least a few times did I meet people saying they only heard of Touhou because of hentai. Or refer to Touhou as "ah, that hentai series". And on that topic, isn't (or at least was) Touhou like the No #3 most popular and drawn tag on inappropriate art websites? Guess that is also a way of getting introduced into this series...

 

1 hour ago, Tenkko said:

I personally think it's ok to draw characters however you want. Some people get a bit aggressive about it but eh whatever. The whole thing about "fixing art" is dumb though and, if it's still happening I honestly don't keep up with it. From what I know it was about making them less sexualized, more than anything else. Linmie's case isn't any of that, to be clear.

Personally, I actually like Linmie's art. There is something cute about it, proportions look realistic, and the hair looks fluffy. I am perfectly OK with "tanned Reimu" as a fan interpretation. I mean, we already have tanned Cirno canonically (thank you, Touhou 16). But yeah. Personal interpretation and artistic license is one thing. But ""fixing art"" the Twitter way is something I personally do not agree with. 

In a way, I find it ironic. The Japanese (and some western) artists tend to sexualize the characters a lot. And I mean A LOT. It is exactly like I was saying, with artists seemingly having only two boob sizes (flat or huge), or just try to make them overall "thicc". Then, there come the westerners to "de-sexualize" them, making them more "PC", I guess?

Why am I bringing up all these things? Because I think they are also a piece of the fandom's behavior, and art (safe for work or not) have been part of the fan culture ever since day 1. Also as a whole I am happy to see people from other parts of the world who like this series. In my case, I am Romanian. Normally, you would not expect to see Touhou fans in here, but we somehow exist. 


I have also checked your blog. I really like the stuff you have presented in there, and would surely like to see more like this in the future. 

 

Edited by CountVonNumenor
  • Like 2

spacer.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know how people see us from the outside but, I think the group that share "all fans are pedos" is very, very small.

The people who refer to general horny are more common. And I mean yeah no series is free from it (I do wonder how many people got in from that side lol).

(also thanks! I just want to share what I find really)

 

  • Like 4

everything is just peachy tonsh.gif.0b4075faabf61d7265e5c3fea342964f.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, Tenkko said:

And I mean yeah no series is free from it (I do wonder how many people got in from that side lol).

Even if it sounds strange, yeah, somehow I'd actually be curious to know how many people unironically discovered Touhou through hentai, be it illustrations or doujins. Especially since the internet really does not seem to lack such material, and I already mentioned the extent to which it is popular when it comes to Touhou material. 

It is funny how a series that doesn't try doing fan service at all ends up having more fanservice made BY THE FANS than others series whose official materials are... more versed into it. I will start writing later a thread about the relation between Touhou and fan service, at least based on my exposure to it until now.

Edited by CountVonNumenor
  • Like 1

spacer.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Now, I have a great question: if someone will be interested to put every bit of info discussed in the past few weeks about all the aspects of the fandom, who will put everything together in a form that would gain traction? Be it an article, a video, an essay in a visible place to get as much traction as possible at least in the community

Edited by CountVonNumenor

spacer.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, CountVonNumenor said:

Now, I have a great question: if someone will be interested to put every bit of info discussed in the past few weeks about all the aspects of the fandom, who will put everything together in a form that would gain traction? Be it an article, a video, an essay in a visible place to get as much traction as possible at least in the community

As much as I find the idea appealing I feel there should be some careful planning behind this, since this will a huge subject to tackle I think it would be wise to take ALOT research and effort to have this not only gain the attraction of the fandom but also to bring awareness to some of the topics that not many people are willing talk about, even if it causes controversies among fans though at the same time this could also spark discussions among fans, that way it can get the message across even farther (Even if it gets ugly), I'm not sure how much I'm willing contribute to this whole thing but if we must work tirelessly to have our point come across then so be it, after-all this fan-base was built upon discussions and interpretations in the first place, no? Even if it starts a shitshow it still must be brought up somehow, besides I don't people thinking we're only doing this just for attention or clout.

Though the only question I have is: Is it even worth it?

Edited by TheM3ds
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, TheM3ds said:

As much as I find the idea appealing I feel there should be some careful planning behind this, since this will a huge subject to tackle I think it would be wise to take careful research and effort to have this not only gain the attraction of the fandom but also to bring awareness to some of the topics that not many people are willing talk about,

Most definitely. The research work has only begun, and sadly for the moment it is only stuck to the level of this relatively little forum online. We will need more weeks, months or even a few years in worst case scenario until we could get to have the whole info and put it together. As for the released info possibly causing a shitshow, I am very much aware that will happen. I have tested waters until now with though-provoking (and potentially controversial) topics on r/touhou, and until now only once did it end badly. 

The one thing I am personally afraid is that the release of this examination might start a bit of a panic in the fandom, and would lead to the intensification of gatekeeping. Big authors even among the essay youtubers are afraid to tackle the fandom problem, most likely due to it causing a mess, and hate getting put on their shoulders just because they addressed the problem.

But yeah, if we are to come to something good, we will need more time until putting everything together. And personally, I am feeling quite willing to be part of this. Maybe it's just me getting easily heated up when it is something I am passion about, or just the fact it is in the job of a future diplomat/politician/political scientist to speak up when things are not going right. And currently I feel like things are not really going right. 

spacer.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, CountVonNumenor said:

The one thing I am personally afraid is that the release of this examination might start a bit of a panic in the fandom, and would lead to the intensification of gatekeeping. Big authors even among the essay youtubers are afraid to tackle the fandom problem, most likely due to it causing a mess, and hate getting put on their shoulders just because they addressed the problem.

But yeah, if we are to come to something good, we will need more time until putting everything together. And personally, I am feeling quite willing to be part of this. Maybe it's just me getting easily heated up when it is something I am passion about, or just the fact it is in the job of a future diplomat/politician/political scientist to speak up when things are not going right. And currently I feel like things are not really going right. 

I was well aware of the risks long before this discussion even started, even if we mange to stir up chaos in the community, even if we receive all the hate and backlash we'll still make it work out hopefully, if we play our cards right and figure things out with time and patience then this might work in our favor, after all you gotta have brass balls to do this kind of thing. 

Though we don't know how much people are willing to be involved with this.

Edited by TheM3ds
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.